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Why did we baptize Hitler


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#1 LDSChristian

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:42 PM

I saw this and was surprised. Is it because the church believes everyone deserves a second chance, even some of the worst people like Hitler?

Edited by Dravin, 04 February 2011 - 01:02 PM.
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#2 mrmarklin

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:46 PM

Well..............Hitler did have relatives. I admit it's a little shocking!

#3 Jenamarie

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:51 PM

Thankfully the determination of who is and isn't worthy of recieving Eternal blessings isn't left in the hands of men. From my understanding, we baptize *everyone* whose records are submitted, and leave the judging up to God.
And I will bring the blind by a way that they knew not; I will lead them in paths that they have not known: I will make darkness light before them, and crooked things straight. These things will I do unto them, and not forsake them.
Isaiah 42:16

#4 pam

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:55 PM

Thank you Jenamarie. You beat me to it.

#5 LDS_Guy_1986

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:57 PM

I saw this and was surprised. Is it because the church believes everyone deserves a second chance, even some of the worst people like Hitler?


All who never heard the fullness of the gospel in this life can potentially inherit the celestial kingdom if they accept the gospel in the spirit world. We have no clue about Adolf Hitlers eternal state, I would assume that his actions would send him to the Telestial Kingdom after judgment regardless of anything he does in the spirit world, but that is my opinion.

If he is repentant and accepts the Gospel in the spirit world then who knows, that is between Hitler and Jesus. The important thing is that he is also a spirit child of God and we are told to baptize our dead, not just the dead we like.

If Hitler was to receive salvation in the spirit world it would be held against us if we didn't perform his ordinances!

Edited by Dravin, 04 February 2011 - 01:02 PM.
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#6 LDSChristian

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:57 PM

Thankfully the determination of who is and isn't worthy of recieving Eternal blessings isn't left in the hands of men. From my understanding, we baptize *everyone* whose records are submitted, and leave the judging up to God.


Yea I always thought baptism for the dead was similar to missionary work. You teach to others and they choose to or not to accept the gospel. We baptize for the dead and they choose to accept it or not accept it. I agree with what you said, it's up to God with who enters the kingdom of God but I do think it's good to baptize people even though it sounds questionable such as with Hitler. As far as we know, considering how merciful God is, Hitler could at least go to the Terrestrial Kingdom so who knows.

#7 Ezequiel

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:57 PM

Not only that, but just because his work was done, it doesn't mean he gets to exaltation free from responsibility. He still needs to repent of his sins, and accept the ordinances that were made in the temple in his behalf. So really, he still has a long way to go. Fortunately, God is the Judge.

#8 LDSChristian

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 03:59 PM

All who never heard the fullness of the gospel in this life can potentially receive it in the next. We have no clue about Adolf Hitlers eternal state, I would assume that his actions would send him to the Telestial Kingdom after judgment regardless but that is my opinion.

If he is repentant and accepts the Gospel in the spirit world who knows. The important thing is that he is also a spirit child of God and we are told to baptize our dead.

If Hitler was to receive salvation in the spirit world it would be held against us if we didn't perform his ordinances!


True. I do wonder which is worse: killing so many people like Hitler did or denying Christ 3 times like Peter did.

#9 MarginOfError

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 04:12 PM

If were going to delve into theoreticals, it's possible that Hitler could be deemed so insane that he was not accountable for his actions, in which case he could be eligible for exaltation. I don't know, don't care, and don't believe one way or the other.

Dude. When both Vort and MOE are in agreement, the thinking has been done. :D


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#10 Seminarysnoozer

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 04:21 PM

Yea I always thought baptism for the dead was similar to missionary work. You teach to others and they choose to or not to accept the gospel. We baptize for the dead and they choose to accept it or not accept it. I agree with what you said, it's up to God with who enters the kingdom of God but I do think it's good to baptize people even though it sounds questionable such as with Hitler. As far as we know, considering how merciful God is, Hitler could at least go to the Terrestrial Kingdom so who knows.


I agree. I think those that do the missionary work will sometimes have to stand as a witness to having given the person on opportunity to accept the gospel, and that they really did slam the door in their faces. Likewise, I think there are some that will stand witness that their work was done for the dead and so the opportunity to receive that ordinance was officially offered by someone still under the authority of that given law.

#11 LDS_Guy_1986

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 04:34 PM

True. I do wonder which is worse: killing so many people like Hitler did or denying Christ 3 times like Peter did.




Personally I think Peter's denial of Christ are far less "wrong" since it was under great duress and he denied him out of fear of his life (remember that Abraham was allowed to lie to Pharaoh that Sarah was his sister to protect his life)

Of there is no "big sin" and "little sin" in God's eyes, sin is sin to him.

#12 MarginOfError

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 04:40 PM

Personally I think Peter's denial of Christ are far less "wrong" since it was under great duress and he denied him out of fear of his life (remember that Abraham was allowed to lie to Pharaoh that Sarah was his sister to protect his life)

Of there is no "big sin" and "little sin" in God's eyes, sin is sin to him.


Another interpretation would be that Christ's prediction that Peter would deny him three times wasn't so much of a prediction as it was a command.

Dude. When both Vort and MOE are in agreement, the thinking has been done. :D


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#13 Dravin

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 04:43 PM

Another interpretation would be that Christ's prediction that Peter would deny him three times wasn't so much of a prediction as it was a command.


Mark (14:72) and Matthew (26:75) have him weeping once he realized what he'd done. Which suggests remorse/shame to me, particularly considering the prediction/commandment that he'd deny Christ came after Peter's boasting that he'd never be offended by Christ (Matt. 26:31-35). Though I suppose one can argue with his zeal keeping the commandment was difficult, but there is still the circumstance of the prediction/commandment that makes me lean away from such an interpretation.

Edited by Dravin, 03 February 2011 - 04:51 PM.

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#14 LDS_Guy_1986

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 04:47 PM

Another interpretation would be that Christ's prediction that Peter would deny him three times wasn't so much of a prediction as it was a command.


That too is very possible.

#15 Just_A_Guy

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 06:26 PM

If were going to delve into theoreticals, it's possible that Hitler could be deemed so insane that he was not accountable for his actions, in which case he could be eligible for exaltation. I don't know, don't care, and don't believe one way or the other.


And let's not forget that, as per our official theology, if six-year-old Adolf Hitler had chanced to be underneath a falling piano--he'd be in the Celestial Kingdom right now.

We have no idea what forces combined to make Hitler the sick monster he was, and to what degree his own agency did or didn't play a role. Best to defer judgment.
This is one of those days that the pages of history teach us are best spent lying in bed.

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#16 bytebear

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 08:49 PM

"I, the Lord, will forgive whom I will forgive, but of you it is required to forgive all men."
-Doctrine and Covenants 64:10

Edited by bytebear, 03 February 2011 - 09:14 PM.


#17 Wingnut

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 09:13 PM

True. I do wonder which is worse: killing so many people like Hitler did or denying Christ 3 times like Peter did.


Another interpretation would be that Christ's prediction that Peter would deny him three times wasn't so much of a prediction as it was a command.


Beat me to it. It's a common interpretation, and my personal belief, that it was not prophecy but rather command that Christ spoke. He knew that Peter would be crucified with Him (if he didn't deny association), and Peter was needed alive to lead the Church.

"I, the Lord, will forgive whom I will forgive, but of you it is required to forgive all men."
-Doctrine and Covenants 64:1


64:10
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#18 mrmarklin

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 10:42 PM

Now that I think it over, is this supposed "record" real???????

#19 bytebear

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 10:50 PM

I'm sure the names were submitted as a joke or a test by non/ex-Mormons. In fact, I hear that Hitler is resubmitted several times a year. The process is imperfect.

#20 HEthePrimate

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Posted 03 February 2011 - 11:03 PM

Maybe Hitler will repent and become a great guy, a bishop, and your best friend in the next life! Just imagine the sacrament meeting talks... :D :lol:
"Laughter is the closest distance between two people." -- Victor Borge (1909 - 2000)




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