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What is the churches view on transgendeer and dress codes?

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#1 Darkpaw1

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Posted 15 January 2012 - 04:29 AM

I know transgenders are considered the sex they are born in "down there", what confuses me is does all the principles of apply as to such. For example: A transgender goes to a beach YSA event.Now in this case the transgender is a male by sex but has a female figure, as in female with the exception of whats between his legs. Now she goes to a YSA beach event, what does he wear? She is considered a male so naturally she would go in shorts and topless but at the same time his body is of a womans. It seems in either case it would be dressing modest or looking and feeling quite out of place; absolutely no middle ground. What is the church's veiw on this, as he is still a male and should be treated as one but at the same time the role of medesty may fall in but in this sense his chest are no different than a kid thats a bit chubby just he has a female body to match. What is the churches veiw on this? Another is transgender's and marriage. How does the church veiw transgenders and dating/ marrying? I mean, it would be pretty odd for a male with the body of a female dating another female, but at the same time it might be wrong for a guy to date a female appearing transgender. Laslty what are the church's veiw on dress code for transgenders? Do they have to dress as their gender or as they feeel, does this account to normal genders too? Like say theres a transgender female who looks likes an average male, does she wear a church suite which would look normal but not fit her sex, or a church dress which would look out of place, vice versa. And what of a regular gender, is it a sin to cross dress? I guess you can see how the questions are related? I was unable to find any answers about such things anywhere, I figured sicne its a year or so later since I actually tryed to find an answer some people might know now. If anything feel free to share your opinons. Personally as far as the beach attire would go, I would say if the transgender feels ok with it let them go in swimtrunks and topless. Not just on gender equality but for the fact of respect. It wouldnt be easy for a guy to not rudely stare at first butthis is point, they have to learn to respect that person. And I'm certain after a couple of beach events or so they would learn to respect that guy (guess this could be said for women's breast too); nonetheless onced they see that guy as truly a guy and not a woman they wont treat him as suh anymore. is shapped as of a woman, and would help ease them into comforting zone, especially if its in a area where not everyne is a member and might not know she is acctually a he. Or do both, the above for in sanctioned pool events with members who are aware or who you can amke known your sex and the one below for public events like beaches. And on the other side, wearing a woman's bathing suite fits as well. As their body

#2 Jezebel2011

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Posted 15 January 2012 - 08:25 AM

First of all you need to differentiate between a transgender simply dressing as the opposite sex and a full transexual whom is post-op and has undergone the hormone and surgical treatments to change to the opposite sex. As far as I am aware a transgender may be baptised in the LDS Church but may not hold the Priesthood or be Endowed in the Temple. I think this assumes post-op, ie a full transexual. It would seem to me that a man whom has been changed physically to a woman must then dress as a woman and vice versa. In the UK now a new birth certificate can be issued to post-op transexuals whereby the sex can be changed: not sure on the US. In the UK a person may marry according to their current birth certificate so if a transexual female wants to marry a male then they are allowed to do this and similarly for a transexual male to marry a female.

Edited by Jezebel2011, 15 January 2012 - 08:35 AM.
to add info

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#3 annewandering

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Posted 15 January 2012 - 08:31 AM

For the beach a tank top with shorts would work wouldnt it? It would cover both issues. Men and woman wear a lot of clothes in common so non gender clothing doesnt sound that hard to do. Mostly it makes sense to not make people uncomfortable and also to be modest. As a woman I would greatly prefer a transgender person use the restroom of birth sex. None of this is, of course, doctrine although modesty standards are given to us regardless of sex. There have been threads discussing the churches stand on this site in the last year. Perhaps one of them has an answer to your doctrinal question?

#4 Darkpaw1

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Posted 15 January 2012 - 09:05 PM

Yeah, what I mean is transgenders who are post op, who aslo lean heavily toward their unintended sex, sch as a male completely appearing female. with the exception of his sex which is down there. Reason why I ask is because there seems to be a huge grey area when it comes to transgenders. Like wha about a transgender pre op who has joined the church. It is a sin to get a sex change type of surgery or take the hormones, so they have to live intended a their sex. Now if a transgender pre op was to join the church naturally he/she would be comfortable with their sex and body so i cant see any reason for them to get a sex change surgery. but this still leaves the question as to whom would they date? Jezebel, you are saying that they should dress acccording to their outside appearence of their sex, since that clothing would best fit their appearence. But at the same you are saying they must date somone opposite of their actual sex. This means a transgendered pre op male must date a woman, but they still both have the same body, with a small exception.Not to mention making that step toward woman might be difficult since both their body and homones are geared toward attracting and being attracted to men. This is where the grey zone lies. Hormones says the sex opposite of their outer body, but their sex between their legs says the the opposite of their actual sex, but by doing this they are being with somone whose outer body resemlbes the same sex as theres, and overall their homrones say go date a person whose outher sex appearence is opposite. So either way they mess up either by their exact sex, there appeared sex, or there hormonones who steers them toward such sex?

#5 Eowyn

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Posted 15 January 2012 - 09:11 PM

Is this a common problem? It sounds like a special case that needs to be discussed with the bishop.

#6 john doe

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Posted 15 January 2012 - 09:29 PM

Is this a common problem? It sounds like a special case that needs to be discussed with the bishop.



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#7 FunkyTown

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 12:23 AM

Pre-op? Who would they date?

They're a guy. A guy with breasts, but they're a guy.

Post-op? Depends. You'd have to discuss it with your bishop.


Yeah, what I mean is transgenders who are post op, who aslo lean heavily toward their unintended sex, sch as a male completely appearing female. with the exception of his sex which is down there.

Reason why I ask is because there seems to be a huge grey area when it comes to transgenders. Like wha about a transgender pre op who has joined the church. It is a sin to get a sex change type of surgery or take the hormones, so they have to live intended a their sex.

Now if a transgender pre op was to join the church naturally he/she would be comfortable with their sex and body so i cant see any reason for them to get a sex change surgery. but this still leaves the question as to whom would they date?

Jezebel, you are saying that they should dress acccording to their outside appearence of their sex, since that clothing would best fit their appearence. But at the same you are saying they must date somone opposite of their actual sex. This means a transgendered pre op male must date a woman, but they still both have the same body, with a small exception.Not to mention making that step toward woman might be difficult since both their body and homones are geared toward attracting and being attracted to men.

This is where the grey zone lies. Hormones says the sex opposite of their outer body, but their sex between their legs says the the opposite of their actual sex, but by doing this they are being with somone whose outer body resemlbes the same sex as theres, and overall their homrones say go date a person whose outher sex appearence is opposite. So either way they mess up either by their exact sex, there appeared sex, or there hormonones who steers them toward such sex?


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#8 Jezebel2011

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 02:47 AM

Yeah, what I mean is transgenders who are post op, who aslo lean heavily toward their unintended sex, sch as a male completely appearing female. with the exception of his sex which is down there.

Reason why I ask is because there seems to be a huge grey area when it comes to transgenders. Like wha about a transgender pre op who has joined the church. It is a sin to get a sex change type of surgery or take the hormones, so they have to live intended a their sex.

Now if a transgender pre op was to join the church naturally he/she would be comfortable with their sex and body so i cant see any reason for them to get a sex change surgery. but this still leaves the question as to whom would they date?

Jezebel, you are saying that they should dress acccording to their outside appearence of their sex, since that clothing would best fit their appearence. But at the same you are saying they must date somone opposite of their actual sex. This means a transgendered pre op male must date a woman, but they still both have the same body, with a small exception.Not to mention making that step toward woman might be difficult since both their body and homones are geared toward attracting and being attracted to men.

This is where the grey zone lies. Hormones says the sex opposite of their outer body, but their sex between their legs says the the opposite of their actual sex, but by doing this they are being with somone whose outer body resemlbes the same sex as theres, and overall their homrones say go date a person whose outher sex appearence is opposite. So either way they mess up either by their exact sex, there appeared sex, or there hormonones who steers them toward such sex?


Actually I was not.

I work in therapy and have dealt with a lot of these problems through my work over the last 20 years. Not that I have seen anyone in Church with these problems.

If a man is 'transgendered' but does nothing about it other than cross-dress then they are transvestite.

My work experience has been that a full transgendered male pre-op without hormone treatment would not want to appear to be male.

Are you sure you aren't posting this as a cheap thrill?

Edited by Jezebel2011, 16 January 2012 - 02:49 AM.

‎"Do not pray for tasks equal to your abilities, but pray for abilities equal to your tasks. Then the performance of your tasks will be no miracle, but you will be the miracle."
— Thomas S. Monson


1 Corinthians 2:14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.




#9 FunkyTown

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 07:56 AM

Yeah. I mean, obviously it's a cheap thrill post - Suggesting people should go bare-breasted to the beach is pretty contrary to the Strength for Youth. Then asking if a Transgendered person, pre-op, should be dating guys or girls put the question of whether it was serious or not to bed.

But the question of transgendered individuals in the church has come up. Last time a post was made on this, there was a surprisingly lot of people with at least some experience in this. The answer is always, "Ask your bishop." for anyone who is seriously questioning that.

Actually I was not.

I work in therapy and have dealt with a lot of these problems through my work over the last 20 years. Not that I have seen anyone in Church with these problems.

If a man is 'transgendered' but does nothing about it other than cross-dress then they are transvestite.

My work experience has been that a full transgendered male pre-op without hormone treatment would not want to appear to be male.

Are you sure you aren't posting this as a cheap thrill?


Yeah. I mean, obviously this is being posted as a cheap thrill - The tipoff is asking what a pre-op transexual

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#10 Darkpaw1

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 06:59 PM

Its not soemthignt hat came up in my church or anything but I have seen it pop up in a cuple of other churches. Thismade me cuiouson the churches standings with transgendered regarding transgenders.I shared what I know but most of it is related to cross dressing and homosexuality; which we all know is a big sin. But none of what pulled up is about transgender, though I didoverhear in a converstaion about it a while ago that they have to date somone opposite of there sex. And this I found quite unfair if it was true, thus it sat at the back of my mind. And now I'm here posting the question to see if a year later after I overheard this rumor (and finally have a computer and found a church site) to find an answer. And I agree most people do answer with "ask your Bishop". Whcih is an good answer but I'm more looking for opinions, as bishops dont seem to knowthe exact answer on such a thing since the church hasn't given concrete standards on pre-op transgenders. I just feel that the church needs to address this at that leaves a big grey area for certain people who are born like this. A person who is investigating the church feels really ecite to join but then when she learns in her interview she'll have to reveal her sex she resets the date of her interview for baptism. Then she doessn't see the churches standard on transgenders so she either A) lie and has larger problems later or B) never join because she wouldnt wanna risk getting excommunicated in the future or some other form of odd embarresment or trouble. Sure she could simply ask somone but who is she/he gonna ask, its not like you can ask a Missionary "hey can I join even though I am male, down there, and if so what exactly is my guidlines on such things like dress-wear, dating, and priesthood authority". Theres no exact answer for this and thys the grey area effect. I just wanna know if you gys have any insight or whats your opinion on this case. And of course direct fact answers are welcome too.

#11 annewandering

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 08:38 PM

There isnt any answer except to talk to your bishop if its your situation. If they dont know the answer they can contract someone to help them with the question. In life there are always going to be situations that do not fit the standard situation which is why bishops have ways to help answer the questions for each individual.

#12 Darkpaw1

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Posted 19 January 2012 - 03:45 AM

Guess you're right on that one. If anything it cant b helped since nobody seems to have an opinion on the matter itself, thanks dude.

#13 FunkyTown

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Posted 19 January 2012 - 04:17 AM

Guess you're right on that one. If anything it cant b helped since nobody seems to have an opinion on the matter itself, thanks dude.


Excellent! Now you can go to the Bishop and get the real, straight-from-the-horses-mouth response.

Isn't it wonderful that members are so non-judgmental that questions such as yours are sent to the Bishop for the truth rather than random people with random feelings towards or against transgendered individuals try to pick fights?

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#14 Jezebel2011

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Posted 19 January 2012 - 05:53 AM

There is medical evidence regarding transgender which I am not prepared to share here since I will be shot down in flames.

‎"Do not pray for tasks equal to your abilities, but pray for abilities equal to your tasks. Then the performance of your tasks will be no miracle, but you will be the miracle."
— Thomas S. Monson


1 Corinthians 2:14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.




#15 FunkyTown

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Posted 19 January 2012 - 06:24 AM

Hooray for not starting a flame war!

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#16 Darkpaw1

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Posted 22 January 2012 - 01:15 AM

There is medical evidence regarding transgender which I am not prepared to share here since I will be shot down in flames.


Feel free to share dude don't mind the flamers. I ama ctually quite curious what medical evidence you might know that may or may not influence the churchs decion to motion a change in how they handle transgenders. After all it wouldn't be the first time the church had to reference a scientific analysis, which often helped explain or understandings, such as abortion.

#17 Schwesterherz

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:56 PM

I just have asked myself the following question: How would I react if I would fall in love with such a person? A person who was born as man. Who had still a male body despite hormones and chests. How would I react if this person were moreover a member of the church? I think I would freak out. I would be furious and violent. I know this is not okay but I would feel so.
„Before you echo Amen in your home or place of worship, think and remember. A child is listening.” ]--- Mary Griffith




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