Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Ppi?


  • Please log in to reply
70 replies to this topic

#1 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:24 PM

Personal Priesthood Interview.

Let me give you some background. I've been LDS my whole life. I can point to times in my life when I have had priesthood interviews. From my father as a youth. From my bishop, stake president, etc. During my mission I had interviews with my mission president and companionship inventory. I have had many 'discussions' during my married life with my wife. But I would not put those under the PPI heading... Most recently with my teenage children, a father's interviews and discussion have become necessary and are quite effective...

Anyway to get to the point -
I recently moved into a new ward and was called into the elders quorum presidency. Wherein I was informed that we are to do PPI's monthly with each member of the quorum. My response was 'WHAT THE heck?' I was informed that I was to ask pointed questions concerning the Elder, his family, job circumstances, his marriage, home teaching families, set goals with him both personal and family, and ask him if he was exercising his priesthood. And if there were any recommendations that he had for the quorum presidency.

This was strange because it seemed like an undue amount of time committment on both the quorum members and presidency. And frankly I am a quiet person and somewhat anti-social and I really don't want to get into other members personal business. Not to mention the issues of confidentiality, etc. Furtermore I was not set apart to do such intimate interviews neither was I trained in how to conduct these interviews. And if there are issues that come up during these interviews... I assume that I would defer such issues to the bishopric anyway. And I have never had such an interview as a member of my previous quorums.

The term Personal Priesthood Interview can neither be found in the LDS Cannon nor in the Handbook. The closest thing that I have found is in

Church Handbook 2
7. Melchizedek Priesthood
Elders Quorum President and Counselors and High Priests Group Leader and Assistants

"Where posssible, they visit or interview quorum or group members at least once a year."

Which of course is quite different than the material that I was presented with...

I would love to be enlightened about the origin of these PPIs and the doctrinal foundation upon which they are based.

Personally I think that my time would be better served by just setting up home teaching visits with slacker home teachers and visit with them and their families instead of talking about it.
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#2 M_T_E

M_T_E

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 201 posts

Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:29 PM

I feel as though Vort will swoop in and answer this one.

#3 Anddenex

Anddenex

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 2747 posts

Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:39 PM

As the EQP there are specific interviews you are obligated, so to speak, to do:

1. At least once a year the EQP meets with every person in his quorum. This is a personal interview where you discover how the family is doing. You inquire about their spiritual, emotional, and temporal welfare. If the discussions turns into a worthiness, or a confession, you politely ask the Elder to stop and refer him to the Bishop.

These interviews may happen more than once a year depending on the need of individual Elders. It appears you have been asked to do this interview once a month.

Remember, your family comes first, and if you are unable to perform these interviews once a month -- due to family circumstances and the need to be a father -- then do your best.

2. Stewardship Interviews. Once a quarter you visit with every Home Teacher to discuss the home teachers steward. The families they are over. You discuss how the companionship is doing, and find out if there is anything you can do to help.

Stewardship interviews also allow the EQP to assist Elders who are struggling in honoring this assignment. Stewardship interviews are accomplished by the presidency, or the EQP may delegate them to his counselors.

#4 Vort

Vort

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 10101 posts

Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:42 PM

The quorum leader is charged with the responsibility for the well-being of his quorum members. In fact, other than matters of sins to be confessed or temporal welfare, both of which are the bishop's responsibility, any other matter is the purview of the quorum president or group leader. This includes employment, marital difficulties, and other personal matters.

The quorum leader generally keeps the intimate PPIs for himself rather than involve his counselors/assistants, but I suppose a quorum president/group leader can assign those out if he chooses. In my high priest group, the group leader does all of the "real" PPIs, while the assistants do quarterly "home teaching" PPIs.

I believe you are right; there is no specific scriptural mandate to perform personal Priesthood interviews. Rather, PPIs are one way to fulfill the duties of the calling of quorum president or group leader. As is the case with home teaching, the PPI is a way to discharge the duty and care for the flock. Other methods might be dreamed up, and maybe at some point another way will be used. But for now, home teaching and PPIs are the methods employed to fulfill those duties.

That's my take on it, at least.
As if anyone could knowingly commit sin without being changed both in spirit, body, and mind. Let me say this again, sin changes who we are! --james12
***********************
Nice hand, friend, but those are not the cards I dealt you.

***********************
Impenetrability! That's what I say!

#5 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 21 January 2013 - 08:15 PM

2. Stewardship Interviews. Once a quarter you visit with every Home Teacher to discuss the home teachers steward. The families they are over. You discuss how the companionship is doing, and find out if there is anything you can do to help.

Stewardship interviews also allow the EQP to assist Elders who are struggling in honoring this assignment. Stewardship interviews are accomplished by the presidency, or the EQP may delegate them to his counselors.


Can you find the actual reference from the handbook?

That would be helpful.
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#6 Eowyn

Eowyn

    Senior Moderator

  • Senior Moderators
  • 6206 posts

Posted 21 January 2013 - 11:09 PM

Here you go, mikbone.

Handbook 2: Administering the Church
Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee whithersoever thou goest.

#7 Magen_Avot

Magen_Avot

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 317 posts
  • LocationMiddle East

Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:50 AM

I've heard of PPIs forever myself. Had only a few. I was just released from EQP 4 months ago and for those two years I, and my councilors did conduct them, but I didn't get to all of the members. Like you I don't like prying. The goal was once a quarter for us, but our focus was "what can I do to bless and serve you and your family". We didn't invade privacy or respect- per my definition of invade.

There are no specific guidelines for "PPI" interviews, however if you do a search for "Personal Priesthood Interview" and filter it to 'Melchizedek Priesthood' you will find chapters in priesthood manuals going back to 1975, and talks before and after 1980.

Did you ask for and get any feedback on it? It's always nice to know, but in the end we love, forgive, forget, love (again) and serve. So just do your best!

#8 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:31 AM

Here you go, mikbone.

Handbook 2: Administering the Church


Yes I am aware that the Church Handbook is available online and searchable. What I was asking for, is the actual wording found within the handbook that backs up the practice of the PPI as described to me by my local EQ. You see, I suspect that the PPI is a concept that has been made up.

As a matter of fact if you do a search of the Handbook for the term 'Stewardship' you will find that the word is not found once within the entire book.

I have a bit of a pet peeve when someone receives personal revelation and then proceeds to require that I follow their personal revelation.

For example don't read D&D 89 and tell me that I can't eat chocolate...
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#9 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:49 AM

I've heard of PPIs forever myself. Had only a few. I was just released from EQP 4 months ago and for those two years I, and my councilors did conduct them, but I didn't get to all of the members. Like you I don't like prying. The goal was once a quarter for us, but our focus was "what can I do to bless and serve you and your family". We didn't invade privacy or respect- per my definition of invade.

There are no specific guidelines for "PPI" interviews, however if you do a search for "Personal Priesthood Interview" and filter it to 'Melchizedek Priesthood' you will find chapters in priesthood manuals going back to 1975, and talks before and after 1980.

Did you ask for and get any feedback on it? It's always nice to know, but in the end we love, forgive, forget, love (again) and serve. So just do your best!


Thank you. My wife graduated from J. Ruben Clark law school so I have been instructed long ago on the boolean internet search.

When I found the term PPI within the Ensign, it generally was not associated with the elders quorum.
But with father's interviews - https://www.lds.org/...rviews?lang=eng
Or with a stake president or Bishop - LDS.org - Ensign Article - The Vision of the Aaronic Priesthood
Or a post mortal interview with the Savior - Counseling Together in Marriage - Ensign June 2012 - ensign

I did find the article Keeping Pace - Ensign June 1975 - ensign that does actually comment about home teaching and PPIs. This is the closest that I have come to find the concept that my local EQ perhaps is referring to. But the article has no author listed.

Edited by mikbone, 22 January 2013 - 06:17 AM.

"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#10 Dravin

Dravin

    Gneiss Guy

  • Members
  • 12968 posts
  • LocationIndiana

Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:53 AM

Yes I am aware that the Church Handbook is available online and searchable. What I was asking for, is the actual wording found within the handbook that backs up the practice of the PPI as described to me by my local EQ.


You quoted it yourself in the OP. I would say that monthly qualifies as "at least once per year" wouldn't you? It doesn't mandate monthly, but monthly certainly falls within the wording. Or is your argument, "Well, it mentions interviews but it doesn't call them PPIs!"

Edited by Dravin, 22 January 2013 - 05:58 AM.

Hindsight is all well and good... until you trip.

#11 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:33 AM

I did find a power point presentation on these EQ PPIs - Personal Priesthood Interviews

And I also saw a youtube video of a EQ president stating that he used the monthly PPI as an effective way to increase his quorum's home teachings numbers.

My fear is that someone with a professional administration job is trying to apply what he knows from business to his EQ calling and recommending the same to others.
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#12 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:40 AM

You quoted it yourself in the OP. I would say that monthly qualifies as "at least once per year" wouldn't you? It doesn't mandate monthly, but monthly certainly falls within the wording. Or is your argument, "Well, it mentions interviews but it doesn't call them PPIs!"


I'll quote the statement again for clarity.

"Where posssible, they visit or interview quorum or group members at least once a year"

Monthly does qualify. But then again, so does daily... hourly...
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#13 estradling75

estradling75

    The Grumpy Moderator

  • Head Moderators
  • 3970 posts
  • LocationOut of my Mind

Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:49 AM

I have a bit of a pet peeve when someone receives personal revelation and then proceeds to require that I follow their personal revelation.

For example don't read D&D 89 and tell me that I can't eat chocolate...


Ok I guess I am a bit confused. I mean I get the whole personal revelation thing... I really do. That why I am very well aware of those who can legitimately do so. All those have clear stewardship over me. Anyone else can be safely rejected.

My confusion stems from how can you be getting instruction to hold such PPIs, without said person also having the necessary stewardship to legitimately receive revelation on it?

Now I can understand that you have doubts if this person who (presumably) has a legitimate stewardship over you, has received a revelation on the matter. Or if they are simply trying to meet their responsibilities as best as they know how. But that is not an answer you are going to find in the Handbooks, that is an answer you find on your knees in prayer.
I had a life once... now I have a computer and a modem.

Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply. Stephen R Covey

#14 Dravin

Dravin

    Gneiss Guy

  • Members
  • 12968 posts
  • LocationIndiana

Posted 22 January 2013 - 07:12 AM

I'll quote the statement again for clarity.

"Where posssible, they visit or interview quorum or group members at least once a year"

Monthly does qualify. But then again, so does daily... hourly...


Yep, they do. So does quarterly. You are appealing to the Handbook in a way it isn't meant to be used. It is not a document delineating all possible acceptable actions one may take in pursuit of fulfilling their stewardship or obligations. However, even if we do take it that way, the Handbook which you quoted mentions interviews and it mentions interviews happening more frequently than yearly. You're looking to trump your EQP, or the idea of PPI, with an appeal to the Handbook and based on the part you yourself quoted that dog just won't hunt.

This isn't an argument to sit down and shut up, by all means counsel with the EQP, that is your call, about your concerns of time use and propriety of content.

Edited by Dravin, 22 January 2013 - 07:47 AM.

Hindsight is all well and good... until you trip.

#15 rameumptom

rameumptom

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 7194 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 07:41 AM

I would suggest some of the following things you can do:

1. Do most of the PPIs over the phone, with an annual or biannual in person
2. Call members of the quorum, who have no other calling, but are trustworthy, to do some of the PPIs for you, so you can focus on the members that most need your assistance.
:pope:

Rameumptom: A Holy Stand or Podium, where I can pontificate to my heart's delight.

rameumptom.weebly.com

#16 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 08:37 AM

Ok I guess I am a bit confused. I mean I get the whole personal revelation thing... I really do. That why I am very well aware of those who can legitimately do so. All those have clear stewardship over me. Anyone else can be safely rejected.

My confusion stems from how can you be getting instruction to hold such PPIs, without said person also having the necessary stewardship to legitimately receive revelation on it?


I actually went along with the program for a few weeks, until I felt the impression that what we were doing was wrong. I went to the handbook. Did my research and then discussed my concerns with my EQP.

He expressed great relief. He also felt that the monthly program was particularly burdensome. And despite his efforts, the HT numbers had hovered within the 10-20% range.

The reason I made this post was to get a feeling of what if any other EQ members have experienced with the PPIs and if they were doing them on a monthly, or yearly basis.
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#17 mikbone

mikbone

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 973 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 08:57 AM

Yep, they do. So does quarterly. You are appealing to the Handbook in a way it isn't meant to be used. It is not a document delineating all possible acceptable actions one may take in pursuit of fulfilling their stewardship or obligations. However, even if we do take it that way, the Handbook which you quoted mentions interviews and it mentions interviews happening more frequently than yearly. You're looking to trump your EQP, or the idea of PPI, with an appeal to the Handbook and based on the part you yourself quoted that dog just won't hunt.

This isn't an argument to sit down and shut up, by all means counsel with the EQP, that is your call, about your concerns of time use and propriety of content.


I disagree. I implemented the Handbook in an appropriate manner. I had a concern, knew that the material was not within the standard works. Then I went to the Handbook

Handbook 2
Administering the Church
Introduction

Leaders also learn their duties by studying the instructions in Church handbooks. These instructions can facilitate revelation if they are used to provide an understanding of principles, policies, and procedures to apply while seeking the guidance of the Spirit.



When I was a missionary in southern Chile back in '89, I had to explain to the local bishop that there was no such thing as the 'Holy Bowl' from which the extra sacrament bread was to be discarded into and that no female of the church was permitted to touch.

The handbook speaks for itself.

I feel strongly that monthly or even quarterly PPIs for the Elders Quorum are not the expressed will of the document.
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; it is dearness only that gives everything its value" - Thomas Paine

#18 Anddenex

Anddenex

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 2747 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:13 AM

Can you find the actual reference from the handbook?

That would be helpful.


7.4.4 - Reporting Home Teaching

"In addition, they meet with home teachers regularly to discuss the spiritual and temporal welfare of the members they are assigned and to make plans to help members in need. Confidential information should be reported only to the elders quorum president or high priests group leader, who reports it to the bishop."


This is in addition to monthly reporting of home teaching. EQP's are to meeting regularly with their home teachers to discuss the information mentioned.

I wonder if this is changed wordage from the old handbook and now the newer handbook. I don't have the old handbook to verify, but I do remember while EQP it was mentioned to meet with the home teachers quarterly to discuss their stewardship.

#19 estradling75

estradling75

    The Grumpy Moderator

  • Head Moderators
  • 3970 posts
  • LocationOut of my Mind

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:27 AM

I actually went along with the program for a few weeks, until I felt the impression that what we were doing was wrong. I went to the handbook. Did my research and then discussed my concerns with my EQP.

He expressed great relief. He also felt that the monthly program was particularly burdensome. And despite his efforts, the HT numbers had hovered within the 10-20% range.

The reason I made this post was to get a feeling of what if any other EQ members have experienced with the PPIs and if they were doing them on a monthly, or yearly basis.


It does seem like it would be a great burden to get every elder every month. Which means you need to take your concerns (or your EQP does) to whomever is pushing for the every month PPIs.

Maybe they do it out of ignorance of what is suppose to be done, or maybe they do understand and are choosing to call for it anyways. While getting info from the Handbook will help if the person who is pushing does so ignorantly or unaware. But it going to be of no help if the person understands and feels this is the correct course anyways.
I had a life once... now I have a computer and a modem.

Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply. Stephen R Covey

#20 BadWolf

BadWolf

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 360 posts

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:54 AM

I'm curious if the intent was to ease an annual (or biannual) burden?

Ex) ((ahem, yes, math made simple for Me'self))

120 members needing ppi
10 per month (instead of trying to do all 120 in a month)
20 per month (instead of the above x2)

Therefore its the "monthly" meetings, but still annual or biannual individual.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

IPB Skin By Virteq