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Advice on my marriage problems


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#1 magicmormon

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 03:27 AM

To avoid making this an extremely long post, I will just stick to the main stuff. My wife and I have been married for nearly 3 years. We have one daughter, 18 months old. The last three and a half months have been @#!*% . It has been a loveless and sexless marriage. I am responsible for much of the unhappiness in my marriage because I neglected to help my wife remain in love with me for so long. I am addicted to lust, pornography and masturbation. I've been in PASG and counceling for at least 2 months. I have made some progress. My wife knew about my problems before we got married. It has been a continual problem since, there were times of dishonesty and secrecy. I do not hide in secrecy or dishonesty anymore. My pain is out in the open, I am vulnerable now. I am working on rebuilding intimate relationships with many in my life. About 3 months ago we started seeing a councilor and the bishop because my wife no longer felt she loved me. I was angry at first and felt entitled to that love and to her body and to many other things. I went through many cycles of overcoming these feelings of entitlement, with each cycle, my wife just became more and more stubborn. She got tired of the talks, the ultimatums, and I think the marriage too. I have great spiritual ideas and love my wife. I want to work out our problems, I am commited to us. She isnt sure she wants to commit and it has been that way for 3 months. There were a few small moments of domestic violence, no actual physical abuse or anything of that sort. I hit the wall once and another time I tried to keep her in the same room with me to work out our problems. Now two months later, she decided to serve me with an order of protection and kick me out of my own home. I talked with a lawyer, I probably won't win. When I recieved the news I was being served, I was devastated. It was like the air was taken from my lungs and my world was collapsing. When I learned I wouldn't win or even have a decent chance of winning, my small hopes of returning to my home were dashed. I curled up in a ball and cried till I had no more tears to give. I am a broken man. I have learned much about my savior and the atonement. I have done much repenting. God has seen fit to humble me and let me experience long suffering. Recently, I went to get a massage from a woman in town. I could feel the spirit trying to warn me that all was not right, but I ignored him. The room was dark, lit by candles. I was told to strip naked and lie on the table face down. At one point the "massage therapist" took her top off so that she wouldn't get lotion on it while she worked on me, I had an opportunity to decline, but I accepted instead. I was uncomfortable after that, but because it felt so good to be touched by a woman with tender hands and have that feeling of warmth on my skin, I wasn't courageous enough to tell her to put her top on or to walk out. She offered a happy ending and I declined. I didn't become aroused at all, probably because I wasn't feeling right about what was happening. I emailed my bishop immediately afterwards and confessed. I wish I could tell my wife, but the order of protection prohibits me from saying anything. Even through 3rd party contact. I'm afraid of the consequences. Do you think there will be church disciplinary actions? I still have my temple recommend. I also fear my wife will divorce me, but she is probably going to do that anyways, even if I never get to tell her about this incident... I don't think divorce is an answer, it just creates new problems.Repentance and the Atonement are the answers Beyond the fear, I am more concerned about my standing before God. This is a whole new level of infidelity for me. I understand why I was tempted to do it and I won't be repeating the incident. I've been in a very vulnerable state lately and I've been sustained by God moment to moment. I've been able to endure more pain than I ever thought I could because of the atonement and God's mercy. It was just a few short hours I decided to ignore the spirit and his protection and now I've done something I will regret for the rest of my life. Sigh. This is a shortened an simplified version of my story at best. There are a million details that I couldn't include, but I think I got the point across. Any constructive thoughts or sympathy or even critisim is welcome. What do you think? Thanks in advance.

Edited by magicmormon, 23 January 2013 - 03:34 AM.


#2 Vort

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 09:07 AM

Rough situation. Best of luck to you.
As if anyone could knowingly commit sin without being changed both in spirit, body, and mind. Let me say this again, sin changes who we are! --james12
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#3 EarlJibbs

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 09:41 AM

This seems a prime expample of the rampant distructions that porn brings into a home. I have an observation, in your post you seem to hint that your wife shouldnt leave you. As you mentioned you left out a lot, but I think that the "a lot" that you left out has contributed to her actions. Fight for love, but respect her decisions. Place her in any other womans shoes and it most likely would have turned out similarly for them. At this time, although it may be alone (without your wife), should be used for you. Get your life back on track. Remember that you may feel that since you have already done X X and X that it may not matter that you continue doing those things that got you in this predicament. Focus on you and your problems. Best of luck to you. Stay strong.

#4 magicmormon

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:23 PM

This seems a prime expample of the rampant distructions that porn brings into a home.

I have an observation, in your post you seem to hint that your wife shouldnt leave you. As you mentioned you left out a lot, but I think that the "a lot" that you left out has contributed to her actions.

Fight for love, but respect her decisions. Place her in any other womans shoes and it most likely would have turned out similarly for them.

At this time, although it may be alone (without your wife), should be used for you. Get your life back on track. Remember that you may feel that since you have already done X X and X that it may not matter that you continue doing those things that got you in this predicament. Focus on you and your problems.

Best of luck to you. Stay strong.


Your observation is quite correct. I do believe that she shouldnt leave me. Do you believe she ought to leave me?
I don't believe any man or woman should leave their spouse when they are doing thier best in regards to thier problems, especially when one gets married knowing about those problems before hand. No matter who you marry, you will have to endure some tests and trials that will make you into the man or woman God intends you to be before you enter into his kingdom. Why divorce and start over? especially since she knows I'm commited to her and to God. If you say that some trials are just too hard to bear, I believe there is a scripture that says God won't test us beyond what we are capable of handling... I used to think I wouldn't be able to endure a trial like what I am experiencing now, but with Heavenly fathers help I have managed to handle it moment to moment, breath to breath. Sometimes I feel overwhelmed, but I have been uplifted and supported in those times. As long as I continue to commit to live righteously, God will bless me and things will work out for the best.

As far as leaving a lot out about why my wife doesn't love me anymore, well she doesn't really know why and frankly neither do I. I can only assume that it was neglect on both ends. Lust addiction played it's part, but I think my ADD played a large role as well. I am on meds for the ADD now and have seen great results. I have been making or working on all the changes my wife has asked me to accomplish. She has even admitted how far I've come. Unfortunately she doesn't know if she wants to commit to the marriage or not and it has been a rift between us. I kept pushing for commitment, while she would just scooting away further. I've been pushy and disrespectful at times because I felt entitled that she should be behaving a certain way. There has been a cycle of entitlement and expectations that I've had to let go of, but before I could let go I kept making ulitmatums and such. With each cycle she would move further away and a new cycle would begin before she could heal from the previous one, so it is a downward spiral.

My new attitude is that my time spent with her is a gift. It has always been a gift. She owes me nothing. I am thankful for the time I was allowed to spend with her and I hope she will choose to stay with me. It took me a long time and a lot of painful humbling experiences to get to this point.

Thanks for the advice. Trust and respect have been major hurdles for each of us before the order of protection was served. I hope to get another chance at changing that behavior.
I will also use this time as best I can to focus on my problems. Instead of having a pity party I need to stay focused and keep moving forward.

Edited by magicmormon, 23 January 2013 - 05:32 PM.


#5 Eowyn

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:26 PM

I believe that if I had a girlfriend in such a marriage, I would advise her to leave, and I don't do so lightly. I hope you understand that you have put her through a great deal. I do wish you both the best, but not just the best for you. . . the best for her, too. If you can work it all out and change everything, that's great, but I can completely understand how she has serious doubts of that happening. Most people with these issues don't just change.

"Therefore, let us beware of false prophets and false teachers, both men and women, who are self-appointed declarers of the doctrines of the Church and who seek to spread their false gospel and attract followers by sponsoring symposia, books, and journals whose contents challenge fundamental doctrines of the Church. Beware of those who speak and publish in opposition to God’s true prophets and who actively proselyte others with reckless disregard for the eternal well-being of those whom they seduce. Like Nehor and Korihor in the Book of Mormon, they rely on sophistry to deceive and entice others to their views. They “set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain and praise of the world; but they seek not the welfare of Zion” (2 Ne. 26:29). (Beware of False Prophets and Teachers, supra.)

Elder M Russell Ballard


#6 magicmormon

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:36 PM

Update on the massage problem. Still havent been able to report to the wife. The bishop decided to hold on to my temple recommend for a while and use it as a way to motivate me to keep living righteously. No other disciplinary action is going to be taken.

#7 magicmormon

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:46 PM

I believe that if I had a girlfriend in such a marriage, I would advise her to leave, and I don't do so lightly. I hope you understand that you have put her through a great deal. I do wish you both the best, but not just the best for you. . . the best for her, too. If you can work it all out and change everything, that's great, but I can completely understand how she has serious doubts of that happening. Most people just don't want to change.


Bolded and fixed.

I do understand that I have put her through a great deal. I hope you realize that this addiction doesn't define who I am. There is much more to me than this one problem. As far as this one part of me that is unworthy of her, I want to change that and God is helping me. Fearing and doubting a persons ability to change is really just fearing and doubting God's ability to work miracles.

Divorce is not an answer, it can be a way out, but it always creates new problems. Some of which can last for generations. Divorce disgusts me as much as pornography and sometimes more.

Edited by magicmormon, 23 January 2013 - 05:49 PM.


#8 Eowyn

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:52 PM

I find divorce deplorable as well, except in cases of: ADDICTION ADULTERY ABUSE It sounds like you've handed her all three. I hear a lot of what you want, you feel, you're missing out on, you deserve. What about her?

"Therefore, let us beware of false prophets and false teachers, both men and women, who are self-appointed declarers of the doctrines of the Church and who seek to spread their false gospel and attract followers by sponsoring symposia, books, and journals whose contents challenge fundamental doctrines of the Church. Beware of those who speak and publish in opposition to God’s true prophets and who actively proselyte others with reckless disregard for the eternal well-being of those whom they seduce. Like Nehor and Korihor in the Book of Mormon, they rely on sophistry to deceive and entice others to their views. They “set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain and praise of the world; but they seek not the welfare of Zion” (2 Ne. 26:29). (Beware of False Prophets and Teachers, supra.)

Elder M Russell Ballard


#9 BadWolf

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:53 PM

Eegads, man... Leave the poor woman alone!!! Why on earth would you torture her with your sexcapades? Why do you keep trying to inflict pain on her??? It sounds like she HAS tried, HAS taken you at your (repeatedly broken) word, undoubtedly with your current "its different this time" pleas. If you ACTUALLY love her, let her go. Let her recover from the pain and betrayals you not only left at her feet but forced down her throat, and are still trying to force her to endure. Let. Her. Go. Stop. Causing. Her. Pain.

#10 BadWolf

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:57 PM

I find divorce deplorable as well, except in cases of:

ADDICTION
ADULTERY
ABUSE

It sounds like you've handed her all three. I hear a lot of what you want, you feel, you're missing out on, you deserve. What about her?


Ditto.
ANY of the 3 is enough
Trifecta?

Addiction, Abuse, Adultery, Done.

Please. Take the next few years to work on yourself, and with a good therapist before getting in another relationship. And by few, think 2 at a minimum, and 5 as a reasonable goal.

#11 MorningStar

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 06:36 PM

I don't think women know what they're getting into when they knowingly marry a porn addict. Sometimes they think sex will cure their husbands, which is not true. You said she was tired of ultimatums. What kind did you give her? You said you felt entitled to her body. In what way did you show that? It's pretty major for a woman to get a protection order from her husband, so I feel like we're not getting the whole story. My advice is to not do anything to violate the protection order in any way. When my friend had a protection order, her husband told his son, "Tell your mom I love her." That landed him in jail. If you think there is some hope for your future together, write down everything in a journal and date each entry. Tell her you wanted to confess to her the massage parlor incident, but you couldn't. Maybe document any therapy sessions you go to, addiction recovery groups, etc. It's her decision to make if she wants to give you another chance.

#12 NightSG

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:06 PM

If you think there is some hope for your future together, write down everything in a journal and date each entry.


This, and start a second one for your child. If all else fails, it will mean a lot to her someday to know that you tried, and how much she means to you. If you succeed, it will still be a treasured keepsake for her later in life.

As for the rest, remember Oscar Wilde's words; "Every saint has a past, and every sinner has a future." What separates a saint and a sinner is the same as what separates the past from the future; right now, and what you do with it. Set realistic goals and stick to them. View setbacks as signs you need to work harder, not give up.

I'm not sure how much difference there is between PASG and regular AR, but you might consider AR as a supplement for the porn as well as for anger addiction. Rage can be a tougher addiction to kick than any other, since it doesn't require any supplies; you can't just stop buying materials that feed the addiction, and you can do it alone in an empty room with no preparation.

#13 NeuroTypical

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:12 PM

You have no kids, right? That is a very good thing. Advice: For the love of pete, do not drag innocent kids into this mess. Wait until you have a year or two on planet earth as a stable, mature, no-longer-out-of-control-destructive man. Your marriage may or may not last. Do NOT bring kids into it as a way of staying together.
If I were rich, I'd have the time that I lack, to sit in the synagogue and pray.
And maybe have a seat by the Eastern wall.
And I'd discuss the holy books with the learned men, several hours every day.
That would be the sweetest thing of all.

Ohhh....
If I were a rich man...

#14 MorningStar

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:22 PM

You have no kids, right? That is a very good thing.

Advice: For the love of pete, do not drag innocent kids into this mess. Wait until you have a year or two on planet earth as a stable, mature, no-longer-out-of-control-destructive man. Your marriage may or may not last. Do NOT bring kids into it as a way of staying together.


He said he has an 18-month-old daughter.

#15 magicmormon

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:24 PM

This, and start a second one for your child. If all else fails, it will mean a lot to her someday to know that you tried, and how much she means to you. If you succeed, it will still be a treasured keepsake for her later in life.

As for the rest, remember Oscar Wilde's words; "Every saint has a past, and every sinner has a future." What separates a saint and a sinner is the same as what separates the past from the future; right now, and what you do with it. Set realistic goals and stick to them. View setbacks as signs you need to work harder, not give up.

I'm not sure how much difference there is between PASG and regular AR, but you might consider AR as a supplement for the porn as well as for anger addiction. Rage can be a tougher addiction to kick than any other, since it doesn't require any supplies; you can't just stop buying materials that feed the addiction, and you can do it alone in an empty room with no preparation.


It appears people think I have been misleading or abusive to cause her to file this order of protection. I have never physically harmed, or verbally threatened my wife in any way. I find violence sickening. I was actually blindsided by her decision to get the order of protection. I am not an angry person either. The only reason she was able to file an order of protection against me was because I put a small hole in the wall and also broke my cell phone from chucking it across the room one evening after a long and frustrating argument. She wasn't even in the room with me when I did it. The cops were never called either. She continued to live with me for 2 more months without a single repeated incident, but you can use stuff for up to an entire year before. The laws in our country are really messed up to give a wife so much power.

#16 pam

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:38 PM

I guess I don't know what the laws are or what constitutes eligiblity to receive a restraining order. If police were never called, it then becomes one word against another. It seems like anyone would be able to get one for their spouse just raising their voice.

#17 NightSG

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:52 PM

It appears people think I have been misleading or abusive to cause her to file this order of protection. I have never physically harmed, or verbally threatened my wife in any way.


I know this feeling too well; I could never even really defend myself when my ex wife would slap me or throw things at me. On the other hand, I've put holes in walls and torn up my hands punching other inanimate objects, and yelled myself hoarse more times than I care to admit.
I attribute it to a childhood friend being choked to death by her ex "accidentally." (Considering the time lapse between unconsciousness and death from choking, I have trouble calling that an accident.) I knew then that I can have a pretty hot temper, and I prayed that I would never become like that, and I believe He has answered that prayer a few times.
AR can't hurt, and it's one more thing you can show as proof that you're doing everything you can to fix the problems.

#18 Eowyn

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:52 PM

It sounds like your wife either: 1. Had enough reason to fear for her safety to get the order. You said yourself that many things have been left out, and I think someone abusive and unrepentant is more likely to downplay their abusive actions; or 2. She is remarkably deceitful and manipulative, and got the order for completely selfish reasons which you didn't deserve. In which case, I don't know why you'd want to continue a marriage with someone like that.

"Therefore, let us beware of false prophets and false teachers, both men and women, who are self-appointed declarers of the doctrines of the Church and who seek to spread their false gospel and attract followers by sponsoring symposia, books, and journals whose contents challenge fundamental doctrines of the Church. Beware of those who speak and publish in opposition to God’s true prophets and who actively proselyte others with reckless disregard for the eternal well-being of those whom they seduce. Like Nehor and Korihor in the Book of Mormon, they rely on sophistry to deceive and entice others to their views. They “set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain and praise of the world; but they seek not the welfare of Zion” (2 Ne. 26:29). (Beware of False Prophets and Teachers, supra.)

Elder M Russell Ballard


#19 magicmormon

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 09:13 PM

I find divorce deplorable as well, except in cases of:

ADDICTION
ADULTERY
ABUSE

It sounds like you've handed her all three. I hear a lot of what you want, you feel, you're missing out on, you deserve. What about her?


Of course you hear a lot of my opions, this is my post after all. What about her? I have offered her everything she has ever told me she wanted. I have never abused her physically. I am guilty of critisim and some mild forms of emotional abuse, but who isnt? I already know what you are going to say about the adultry, but I am hardly guilty of having sex with another woman. The bishop would have ex-communicated me or at least disfellowshipped me if that was the case.

Don't make mountains out of mole-hills. The addiction is a serious offense, but she never caught me, I told her about it. I never introduced anything from the stuff I viewed into our bedroom. I've never treated her lewdly. I have always strived to keep our sex life sensual, romantic, and intimate... it was never an issue until she didn't like me anymore and decided she wasn't in love with me anymore. For the most part, it was my problem before marriage and I kept it my problem throughout the marriage. I didn't realize I was addicted. I didn't realize what I needed to overcome it. I just kept telling myself I needed to try harder. I never stopped working on it, I just didn't have the right tools to overcome it.

The massage therapist event was a singular event that occured in a moment of deep pain. It has been over 3 months since I got so much as a pat on the back or hug from my wife, let alone intimate kissing, massages or sex. I have been dealing with feelings of lonliness, rejection, & depression. Then she kicked me out and it felt like the ultimate betrayal because Im not a violent or dangerous person. It was in this place that I sought out a massage. I only wanted to enjoy the touch of tender hands again. A massage sounded nice, but I got more than I bargained for and didn't have the courage to get out of the situation. It was wrong. I feel terrible about it. It was a new level of infidelity. Was it adultry? No.

and I never said I deserve anything, I actually said the opposite. I am so thankfull that my wife hasn't filed divorce papers yet. She is a wonderful woman that has been trying, just trying to get up each day and take care of herself. She said she forgives me and cares about me. We even get along fine. The marital strife isn't over my addiction. It has been over commitment to our marriage. I haven't told her she has to stay with me, I just wanted a decision. I waited for 3 months for her to make a decision. I finally got fed up and told her if she wouldn't commit then I'd just divorce her. I started filling out the paperwork, but I got an answer from God that I wasn't supposed to be doing that, so I swallowed my pride and let it go. Before she knew I had let it go she decided she didn't feel safe with me in the house any more because of my pushy ultimatums. That's what brought me to this point in my life.

I am proud of her for finally making a decision, but I am disappointed because it was the wrong one. I would have understood being served with divorce papers. I would have understood a lock on her bedroom door to feel safer (not that I ever violated her privacy or threatened anything of that nature) but if she didn't feel safe, there were other choices she could make. I don't understand the order of protection though. It hurts us financially and it keeps me away from my daughter (I'm still allowed to see her, just have to make arrangements). It makes life more complicated that it needs to be.

anyways, my point being, it's not so cut and dry as Addiction, Abuse, and Adultry.

Edited by magicmormon, 23 January 2013 - 09:17 PM.


#20 NightSG

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 09:19 PM

It was in this place that I sought out a massage. I only wanted to enjoy the touch of tender hands again. A massage sounded nice, but I got more than I bargained for and didn't have the courage to get out of the situation.


In defense of this, I have had several professional massages from women, and the only massage therapist who offered a "happy ending" was the one I was dating at the time.

(Incidentally, that was also the first time I really felt old; I didn't want to interrupt the massage for sex.)




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