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How's this for unbiased?


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#1 Vort

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:28 PM

From a closed thread:

What I quoted is a portion of a letter that is signed on to by many experts...that have no reason to be the teensiest, weensiest eensiest bit biased as you implied.


Seriously?

Do you really, honestly believe this, Leslie? Do you actually believe that the quoted "experts" have no agenda AND NO REASON TO BE AT ALL BIASED?

I cannot believe you really think that. In your conversations here, you have struck me as an intelligent and honest person, not at all a great fool. How you could therefore conclude that the so-called "experts" cited in this article "have no reason to be the teensiest, weensiest eensiest bit biased" is utterly mystifying to me.

Let us examine only the first few of the extensive list you provide. I will trust you to do research on the others to expose their extraordinarily obvious bias.

Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network (RAINN)

Founded by Scott Berkowitz and Tori Amos. I find very little information about the organization or Scott Berkowitz, beyond the fact that he was obviously an intelligent and highly driven young man who raised funds for Gary Hart as a fifteen-year-old. Beyond suggesting a left-wing bias, this says very little. Tori Amos is, of course, well-known for her leftist political views and hatred of organized religion and George W. Bush. She has a very obvious bent toward the political Left's agenda, including homosexual "rights".

In any case, how is an organization founded to support victims of sexual violence qualified to offer a relevant opinion about homosexuality?

Christina Ricci,
Actress & RAINN Spokesperson

What could Christina Ricci possibly know to qualify as an expert on such issues?

Seriously, Leslie. How is Christina Ricci an expert on homosexuality?

She is publicly "bipartisan" but quite obviously Democrat, based on her political preferences and stances. She sits on the board of VOX, an information outlet for Planned Parenthood. Her social and political stances all skew toward the pro-homosexual. You honestly believe this woman doesn't have an agenda?

And again, how is she an expert? Why is her opinion valuable?

KaDee Strickland,
Actress & RAINN Spokesperson


Same question as with Ricci: How is KaDee Strickland, an actress, qualified to voice a relevant opinion on homosexuality?

Adam Richman
TV Host & RAINN Supporter


Same question.

Victim Rights Law Center
Boston, MA


Same question.

Jack Drescher, MD
President, Group for Advancement of Psychiatry
Distinguished Fellow of the American Psychiatric Association


So here is a man who has made his name and fortune on sexual orientation and gender identity issues, and who has been an outspoken critic of those who try to help homosexuals overcome their same-sex attraction. He was involved in getting the APA to declassify homosexuality as a mental disorder.

You honestly believe this man doesn't have an agenda?

The Rev. Brian D. Ellison,
Executive Director,
Covenant Network of Presbyterians


I don't know what possible qualifications a Presbyterian reverend might have to voice a relevant opinion on homosexuality. But Brian Ellison is an outspoken advocate of homosexuality.

You honestly believe this man doesn't have an agenda?

Idit Klein,
Executive Director,
Keshet


Keshet is a national grassroots organization with offices in Boston, Denver, and the San Francisco Bay Area that works for the full equality and inclusion of lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender Jews in Jewish life.

You honestly believe this woman doesn't have an agenda?

And so it goes.

Leslie, your panel of "experts" is hopelessly biased, EXACTLY CONTRARY to your claim that they "have no reason to be the teensiest, weensiest eensiest bit biased." Seriously, there is nothing in the least little bit unbiased about that group.

As if anyone could knowingly commit sin without being changed both in spirit, body, and mind. Let me say this again, sin changes who we are! --james12
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#2 Wingnut

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:30 PM

Aaaand, countdown to closing begins. In 5...4...3...2...
Now the trouble about trying to make yourself stupider than you really are is that you very often succeed. -- C.S. Lewis

If we're going to be stupid about this, we're going to be stupid on my terms. -- my husband

#3 Vort

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:34 PM

Aaaand, countdown to closing begins.

In 5...4...3...2...


Countdown or not, that doesn't respond to what I wrote. The "experts" are no such thing, and their "unbiased" nature is demonstrably lacking.

As if anyone could knowingly commit sin without being changed both in spirit, body, and mind. Let me say this again, sin changes who we are! --james12
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Nice hand, friend, but those are not the cards I dealt you.
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Impenetrability! That's what I say!


#4 Wingnut

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:35 PM

Countdown or not, that doesn't respond to what I wrote. The "experts" are no such thing, and their "unbiased" nature is demonstrably lacking.


I agree that Christina Ricci is a really bad primary source, and many/most of the others lacked any sort of qualification. That's irrelevant. My point was simply that the thread this is pulled from was closed as a result of accusations (whether true of false) of intellectual dishonesty. How is that different from what you're doing here?
Now the trouble about trying to make yourself stupider than you really are is that you very often succeed. -- C.S. Lewis

If we're going to be stupid about this, we're going to be stupid on my terms. -- my husband

#5 annewandering

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:41 PM

Dont you just hate it when you get all fired up with a detailed comment on a thread and it gets closed on you before you can post? Not saying they should not be closed but need to vent somewhere I guess!!

#6 Vort

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:45 PM

I agree that Christina Ricci is a really bad primary source, and many/most of the others lacked any sort of qualification. That's irrelevant. My point was simply that the thread this is pulled from was closed as a result of accusations (whether true of false) of intellectual dishonesty. How is that different from what you're doing here?


I made no accusations of intellectual dishonesty. Rather, I pointed out that LiterateParakeet's sources were wildly biased, contrary to her stated opinion. I believe her (Leslie) to be honest, so I expect she will respond in kind to the thread.

As if anyone could knowingly commit sin without being changed both in spirit, body, and mind. Let me say this again, sin changes who we are! --james12
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Nice hand, friend, but those are not the cards I dealt you.
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Impenetrability! That's what I say!


#7 LittleWyvern

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:48 PM

From a closed thread:


Posted Image

قُل لَّوْ كَانَ الْبَحْرُ مِدَادًا لِّكَلِمَاتِ رَبِّي لَنَفِدَ الْبَحْرُ قَبْلَ أَن تَنفَدَ كَلِمَاتُ رَبِّي وَلَوْ جِئْنَا بِمِثْلِهِ مَدَدًا


If the ocean were ink wherewith to write the words of God, sooner would the ocean be exhausted than the words of God, even if another ocean was added for its aid.


#8 Vort

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:51 PM

Posted Image


John Doe? Is that you?

As if anyone could knowingly commit sin without being changed both in spirit, body, and mind. Let me say this again, sin changes who we are! --james12
***********************
Nice hand, friend, but those are not the cards I dealt you.
***********************
Impenetrability! That's what I say!


#9 LiterateParakeet

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:52 PM

My apologies to the mods...I have been a moderator in a land far away, LOL...and I have no desire to do that again. I remember that it was very annoying when we closed a thread and the members chose to re-open the topic. On the other hand, as a member it is annoying when you are having a discussion and a mod closes it. So, I debated for a moment whether to respond to this thread or not... Vort, yes, I will be honest. I was not aware of the backgrounds of some of the people you mentioned. And it was eye opening. Thanks for enlightening me. You reminded me of the line in Swing Kids, where the Nazi tells one of the main characters to be careful he knows what he is agreeing to...something like that. (one of my favorite movies by the way...) What I meant was that of course GLAAD has a certain bias regarding homosexuality. However, I don't believe that RAINN has that same bias. In light of what you shared, I still believe that the main purpose of RAINN is about advocating for vicitms or sexual abuse and not furthering a homosexual agenda. But I can see what your point. I hope that helps.

Edited by LiterateParakeet, 07 February 2013 - 12:57 PM.


#10 Anddenex

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:01 PM

You reminded me of the line in Swing Kids, where the Nazi tells one of the main characters to be careful he knows what he is agreeing to...something like that. (one of my favorite movies by the way...)


Yes, I knew we could be friends Leslie! Swing Heil!!

My favorite part, the little brother picks up the umbrella and says, "Swing Heil! Swing Heil!"

The movie that began my love for swing dancing and some of my fondest memories at BYU.

Only cool people quote Swing Kids!

#11 Wingnut

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:04 PM

Yes, I knew we could be friends Leslie! Swing Heil!!

My favorite part, the little brother picks up the umbrella and says, "Swing Heil! Swing Heil!"

The movie that began my love for swing dancing and some of my fondest memories at BYU.

Only cool people quote Swing Kids!


On how many levels are you going to have swing dancing conversations today? Lol!
Now the trouble about trying to make yourself stupider than you really are is that you very often succeed. -- C.S. Lewis

If we're going to be stupid about this, we're going to be stupid on my terms. -- my husband

#12 Anddenex

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:06 PM

On how many levels are you going to have swing dancing conversations today? Lol!


On as many levels as anybody wants to discuss swing dancing with me, or just to point out how cool someone is that they know the movie "Swing Kids."

#13 Wingnut

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:07 PM

On as many levels as anybody wants to discuss swing dancing with me, or just to point out how cool someone is that they know the movie "Swing Kids."


It's been a looooong time since I've seen it. I might have to put it in my Netflix queue.
Now the trouble about trying to make yourself stupider than you really are is that you very often succeed. -- C.S. Lewis

If we're going to be stupid about this, we're going to be stupid on my terms. -- my husband

#14 LiterateParakeet

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:12 PM

Anddenex, LOL, Swing Heil!!! Yes, I love that part with the little brother and the umbrella too. I watched it just recently (for the umpteenth time!) and that part brought tears to my eyes. Wingnut, repent and watch it as soon as possible! :D

#15 Wingnut

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:13 PM

Wingnut, repent and watch it as soon as possible! :D


Okay, I just added it. It's fourth in my queue now, and even though I get two discs at a time, at the rate I return them, it'll probably be six weeks before I get around to watching it. :)
Now the trouble about trying to make yourself stupider than you really are is that you very often succeed. -- C.S. Lewis

If we're going to be stupid about this, we're going to be stupid on my terms. -- my husband

#16 Anddenex

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:19 PM

Sorry Vort for the Hi-Jack! I am compelled anytime makes a comment about "Swing Kids" to make a comment. It is out of my control, no really, out of my control. :)

#17 annewandering

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:21 PM

It is a good thing I didnt read the other thread. grrrrrrrrrr. If I can bring up another flaw in reasoning: Some quote said that male to male pedophilia should be more accurately called male to male molestation. Oh really. So pedophilia sodomy is 'just' molestation now? I dont think so. I mean I really dont think so. It is full blown rape and to call it less is just making it a 'minor' offense as opposed to rape being a major one.

#18 LiterateParakeet

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:25 PM

So pedophilia sodomy is 'just' molestation now? I dont think so. I mean I really dont think so. It is full blown rape and to call it less is just making it a 'minor' offense as opposed to rape being a major one.


I don't know if this will help, but it is meant to be helpful, not argumentative...

I don't think of molestation as a minor offense at all. I suppose I should look up the proper definition, but in my mind molestation is a broad term involving adults having sex with children and covers various levels including rape.

#19 annewandering

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:27 PM

Molestation has more to do with touching with hands etc but no actual penetration of body parts.

#20 LiterateParakeet

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:46 PM

Molestation has more to do with touching with hands etc but no actual penetration of body parts.


With all due respect, that is your opinion, but not the official definition, nor how I think people think of it. After I read your post, I 'googled', and I would have cut and pasted some things here, but I am on a shared computer system, and I got a 5 minute time out from the Internet for researching that. LOL!

I'm not trying to argue with you, it is just that as a writer and also as a survivor of childhood abuse, the speaking clearly about these things is important to me.

Remember you and I are on the same side.




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