Conflicting advice between Bishop and Doctors?

[Jennison]

Hi there.  I have a... well... difficult problem.  I've thought about it and prayed about it, and I had the feeling that I might want to talk to people here and see what they advise or what experiences they may have had.

I want to maintain the spirit of The Lord while I write here, so I will seek to write as discretely about this problem as I can.  I have certain problems with my body because I am on a powerful medicine that causes my hormones to be many times what they should be.  This medication can't be changed or reduced for another year.  I am 24, not married, and likely won't be married for the foreseeable future.  There is no place for these feelings to go.  I wish there were.

Because of this medication, the stress is very strong.  Many of my doctors have advised that I do certain things which my Bishop has taken a very strong opposing stance on.  The opinion of my doctors and the opinion of my Bishop directly contradict.  I'm not sure who to follow, but I would rather follow The Lord.

...And so I am left in a tough place.  I try really hard to be a good person.  I beat myself up all the time.  I do the best I can, but invariably I reach a point where I don't do so well.  It hurts my soul, and I feel like I walk around wounded with an extra burden that is hard enough to bear normally without medications like the one I am on.  I look all around me at my friends being married off, and this makes it worse. 

What should I do?  Should I just continue to struggle through this?  If I have to, I will.  This is more difficult than any other challenge I have faced in my life.

I would have a lot of gratitude for any advice.  Thank you in advance for your kindness.

[The Folk Prophet]

What are you looking for? Advice that it's okay to sin because of medication you are on? I'm not seeing anyone advising you that way.

 

Moreover, your details are too vague to truly advise. What is the medication you are on? What is it's purpose? Why can't the medicine be changed or reduced. Details matter.

[Jennison]

If it is ok, I would rather not talk about the medication in detail save to say that it causes these things to worsen by many degrees.  There are no other options of changing or altering the dose of this medication for the foreseeable future.

[Guest]

There are many many many ways to burn that energy.  If you can engage in intense physical workout - running, soccer, or even just following along with any of Shaun T's videos, you can burn off that hormonal pull without breaking baptismal covenants...

 

Oh, singing along with the Mormon Tabernacle Choir - especially at the top of your lungs with feeling - can also do the trick...  I find singing The Spirit of God like I'm on a Broadway Stage more often than not can get me off a precipice regardless of what kind of sin got me there.

[Guest]

I assume you're talking about stress relief by way of breaking either the Word of Wisdom or Law of Chastity. There are other ways.

[The Folk Prophet]

We're talking libido though, right?

 

Strength of libido is no excuse to action. It's as simple as that. Beyond that, it's impossible to advise specifically because of the lack of detail.

 

I mean, what would you advise if I said I was on a medication that was making me feel homicidal? Go ahead? Kill a few people, it will make you feel better?  Of course not.

 

The fact that your doc doesn't see certain actions as sinful does not make those actions acceptable to the Lord.

[The Folk Prophet]

I assume you're talking about stress relief by way of breaking either the Word of Wisdom or Law of Chastity. There are other ways.

 

Hmm. Word of Wisdom. Didn't think of that.  A medical marijuana suggestion? ???

 

Like I said, lack of detail makes it hard to advise.

[mdfxdb]

doubtful a doctor would advise self-satisfaction as a method to relieve stress... at least I've never heard that one.  If you are looking for permission to smoke medical marijuana...  you wont get it here.   As mentioned before.  Go on a run, exercise, do something physical to relieve the stress/bad feelings.  Exercise is a great way to make yourself feel better about almost everything. 

[estradling75]

You can keep it vague and general...  In fact it might even be wise.  But that limits us to vague and general advise.

 

You have gotten advice and council from your doctor and your bishop... Both whom have acted within their stewardship to council you.  Now it is time for you to exert your stewardship over yourself.  You are the one that has to live with your choices, you are one that has to face God with your actions.

 

Make a choice... then take it to the lord and see if he approves.  If he does then act.  If not the discard that and choose a different one.  What ever choice the lord approves of... do... but know you will have to face the fall out from such a choice

[applepansy]

I agree with everyone that its hard to give advice without more specifics.  I also agree that being more specific probably isn't a good idea.

 

Estradling hit the nail on the head.  It really doesn't matter what medication or side effects.  You have to decide and then deal with the consequences of your choice.  Nobody can really make the decision for you.  

 

I hope you'll make it a matter of prayer and try to err on the side of the Lord.

[MarginOfError]

I have very little advice to give other than to say seek earnestly to learn what it is The Lord finds to be the appropriate answer for you and go with it. I don't particularly care what you choose to do so long as you feel the love and acceptance of the Savior.

More importantly, welcome to our community. If you feel comfortable discussing it, for what condition are you being treated that requires such dramatic therapy? And what can we do to support you while you are being treated?

[Jennison]

I apologize for being so vague.  I just didn't know if it was appropriate to be more forward.

I think I have received the answers I needed.  It is exceedingly difficult, but I'll go with my Bishops recommendation. 

Thank you to everyone who responded.

~J

[Jennison]

doubtful a doctor would advise self-satisfaction as a method to relieve stress... at least I've never heard that one.  If you are looking for permission to smoke medical marijuana...  you wont get it here.   As mentioned before.  Go on a run, exercise, do something physical to relieve the stress/bad feelings.  Exercise is a great way to make yourself feel better about almost everything. 

These things are dealing with an overproduction of hormones.  Apparently, my physicians think that there are ways which reduce these hormones, yet are contrary to Heavenly Father's directions.

It's a frustrating situation, but such as it is I will continue trying to live the way The Lord wants.  

[Quin]

How about this:

Follow your doctor's MEDICAL advice, and your bishop's SPIRITUAL advice.

The two should never contradict.

If they are... Then someone is stepping over their bounds.

Q

[Irishcolleen]

I think we get the picture.  As others have said workout.  Run.  Get on an elliptical machine.  Swim.  Take cold showers.  Lift weights. Go rock climbing. Keep your mind occupied- read, draw, crochet, read your scriptures.  Don't focus on what you can't have; focus on what you can have.

[Theneuroevolutionary]

I think i know what medication group you're referring to. Unfortunately, working out or other similar activities don't relieve this type of tension, especially when it's caused by massive hormonal changes that are beyond the scope that usually naturally occur. No one can make an answer for you. It's always gunna be your option and your choice to make. Just keep in mind Shakespeare's immortal line: "This above all: to thine own self be true." 

[Drpepper]

I try really hard to be a good person. I beat myself up all the time.

I think the advice given on limited information about your issue is sufficient and echo the sentiments of others regarding exercise etc.

It was however the sentence above that grabbed my attention. Probably because I see around these forums and church in general a lot of people beating themselves up. Almost like they carry a spiritual stick around with them, the moment they step one foot out of line they whack themselves like a spiritual piñata. The scriptures talk about the 2 great commandments. Love God, Love our Neighbors. I actually think there is 3 in this invitation. Love our neighbors, as ourselves. For many people they would have to go around beating up their neighbors cause that's what they do to them selves. Hence we need to learn to love ourselves a lot better, be patient in our weakness, softer to our souls and put down the piñata stick. If we can be kinder to our own selves we will find it much easier to love our neighbors and God.

[Quin]

Okay... Feeling compelled to add a bit more:

(And I was so proud at beig concise, for once! Le sigh).

Would a doctor ever tell you to drink alcohol?

Yep.

It's the antidote for antifreeze poisoning.

Would a doctor ever tell you to masturbate?

Yep.

Kinda necessary for IVF & a few other things.

PLEASE... Stop looking for medical advice from people who are not your doctor... And worse, taking it.

HF wants you to be healthy.

HF has placed these doctors in your life to help you achieve that aim.

Why only follow their advice so far, and then ignore it completely in favor of someone who has no idea what all is involved?

My mum (doesn't drink) always keeps a bottle of Everclear in the house...

Because kids do stupid things like drink the "thick Mountain Dew".

Should she just let a kid die, because it's against the word of wisdom to drink alcohol?

Of course not.

But will there be someone, somewhere, who would refuse for alcohol to be poured down their toddler's throat as it bein against God's wishes?

Of course there will be.

There will ALWAYS be someone in your life telling you what God wants.

You're LDS, take I to him, yourself.

HF... Should I follow my doctors medical advice, or my bishops medical advice?

Q

[Guest]

"Should I follow my doctor's advice on WoW/LoC, or my bishop's?"

 

This is all so dependent on the issue at hand. Thank goodness for the Holy Spirit. But I would exhaust all other options before doing something that would violate any of my covenants. 

[Theneuroevolutionary]

"Should I follow my doctor's advice on WoW/LoC, or my bishop's?"

 

This is all so dependent on the issue at hand. Thank goodness for the Holy Spirit. But I would exhaust all other options before doing something that would violate any of my covenants. 

 But I seriously doubt his doctor is telling him to go get a prostitute. masturbation =/= fornication

[Wingnut]

I agree with Neuro on that point.  Personally, I've never made a covenant not to masturbate.

[Guest]

I agree with Neuro on that point.  Personally, I've never made a covenant not to masturbate.

 

Yes you did.  You may not have specifically said, "I covenant not to masturbate" but you did make that covenant at baptism to keep His commandments (Law of Chastity).  It's the same as pirating movies.  You may not have specifically said, "I covenant not to pirate movies", but you did make that covenant at baptism.

 

(highlighted for you)

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/1980/10/president-kimball-speaks-out-on-morality?lang=eng&query=masturbation

https://www.lds.org/manual/young-women-manual-2/living-a-virtuous-life/lesson-33-the-sacred-power-of-procreation?lang=eng&query=masturbation

https://www.lds.org/manual/a-parents-guide/chapter-5-teaching-adolescents-from-twelve-to-eighteen-years?lang=eng&query=masturbation

 

 

In case you don't want to have to go click on the linkies... here's an excerpt from th Parent's Guide:

One example: masturbation is considered by many in the world to be the harmless expression of an instinctive sex drive. Teach your children that the prophets have condemned it as a sin throughout the ages and that they can choose not to do it. Throughout childhood, boys and girls have touched their own genitals frequently to wash and to dress. This is a behavior that usually has the same meaning as keeping one’s feet warm in the winter, enjoying a swim on a hot day, or scratching an itch. We ought to be friendly to our bodies and appreciate the body’s marvelous range of senses. This innocent touching is not the kind of behavior warned against by prophets through the ages. The sin of masturbation occurs when a person stimulates his or her own sex organs for the purpose of sexual arousal. It is a perversion of the body’s passions. When we pervert these passions and intentionally use them for selfish, immoral purposes, we become carnal.

Masturbation is not physically necessary. There is already a way by which the male system relieves excessive spermatic fluid quite regularly through the nocturnal emission or wet dream. Monthly menstrual flow expels the female’s egg and cleanses the womb. For both sexes, physical or emotional tensions can be released by vigorous activity. Thus, in a biological sense, masturbation for either gender is not necessary. In a gospel sense, it is a sin: “Masturbation, a rather common indiscretion, is not approved of the Lord nor of His Church regardless of what may have been said by others whose ‘norms’ are lower. Latter-day Saints are urged to avoid this practice” (Spencer W. Kimball, Love Versus Lust, Brigham Young University Speeches of the Year [Provo, 5 Jan. 1965], p. 22).

 

Are there exceptions to the commandment?  Maybe.  But that's between you and the Lord with the help of your bishop.

[jerome1232]

I agree with Neuro on that point.  Personally, I've never made a covenant not to masturbate.

So you haven't been baptised?

[Theneuroevolutionary]

So you haven't been baptised?

I have been. And I covenanted to keep the commandments. And in the temple I made deeper covenants, which oddly don't seem to include masturbation from the wording. 

I think you'd be very surprised by some of the things past leaders have done under medical direction. 

[Guest]

I have been. And I covenanted to keep the commandments. And in the temple I made deeper covenants, which oddly don't seem to include masturbation from the wording. 

I think you'd be very surprised by some of the things past leaders have done under medical direction. 

 

I don't understand this.  Did you expect the temple covenant to specifically say "masturbation"?  Why?