Spirit Children and Heavenly Parents

[Dorian]

I have a few question:

 

If you achieve your exaltation do you expect to have spirit children and do you expect that they will look to you in the same way you look to Heavenly Father, ie direct prayers to you?

Also, if God were a polygamist (I understand that you don't have a clear teaching either way on how many wives God was sealed to when he was a man), is it possible that there are Heavenly Mothers and while we all have the same Father we don't all have the same mother?

 

Does God worship His own heavenly father?

[jerome1232]

Anything said about this would be pure speculation on our part, and would only be our individual opinions. There is no revealed doctrine on these ideas. The exception maybe is that we do have a heavenly mother.

[Just_A_Guy]

Agreed. The only answer I could give to any of the questions in the OP would be, "it's possible . . ."

[Dorian]

Okay, so if the first one is just hypothetical can someone explain what eternal increase is to me? I've read that only those who reach the highest level of heaven get the blessing of 'eternal increase'. 

[Blackmarch]

I have a few question:

 

If you achieve your exaltation do you expect to have spirit children and do you expect that they will look to you in the same way you look to Heavenly Father, ie direct prayers to you?

Also, if God were a polygamist (I understand that you don't have a clear teaching either way on how many wives God was sealed to when he was a man), is it possible that there are Heavenly Mothers and while we all have the same Father we don't all have the same mother?

 

Does God worship His own heavenly father?

A quite likley eventually.

2) that seems logical

3) that seems logical

Edited September 29, 2014 by Blackmarch

[Anddenex]

Please visit the following link: Eternal Increase.

[Dorian]

"“What do we mean by endless or eternal increase? We mean that through the righteousness and faithfulness of men and women who keep the commandments of God they will come forth with celestial bodies, fitted and prepared to enter into their great, high and eternal glory in the celestial kingdom of God; and unto them through their preparation, there will come spirit children."

 

"“Mortal persons who overcome all things and gain an ultimate exaltation will live eternally in the family unit and have spirit children, thus becoming Eternal Fathers and Eternal Mothers. (D&C 132:19–32.) Indeed, the formal pronouncement of the Church, issued by the First Presidency and the Council of the Twelve, states: ‘So far as the stages of eternal progression and attainment have been made known through divine revelation, we are to understand that only resurrected and glorified beings can become parents of spirit offspring.’ (Man: His Origin and Destiny, p. 129.)” (Mormon Doctrine, 517)."

So, according to the current materials you guys study, you will have spirit children in heaven?

[Seminarysnoozer]

I have a few question:

 

If you achieve your exaltation do you expect to have spirit children and do you expect that they will look to you in the same way you look to Heavenly Father, ie direct prayers to you?

Also, if God were a polygamist (I understand that you don't have a clear teaching either way on how many wives God was sealed to when he was a man), is it possible that there are Heavenly Mothers and while we all have the same Father we don't all have the same mother?

 

Does God worship His own heavenly father?

True worship is the desire to be like Him.

 

D&C 93; "11 And I, John, bear record that I beheld his glory, as the glory of the Only Begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth, even the Spirit of truth, which came and dwelt in the flesh, and dwelt among us.

 12 And I, John, saw that he received not of the fulness at the first, but received grace for grace;

 13 And he received not of the fulness at first, but continued from grace to grace, until he received a fulness;

 14 And thus he was called the Son of God, because he received not of the fulness at the first.

 15 And I, John, bear record, and lo, the heavens were opened, and the Holy Ghost descended upon him in the form of a dove, and sat upon him, and there came a voice out of heaven saying: This is my beloved Son.

 16 And I, John, bear record that he received a fulness of the glory of the Father;

 17 And he received all power, both in heaven and on earth, and the glory of the Father was with him, for he dwelt in him.

 18 And it shall come to pass, that if you are faithful you shall receive the fulness of the record of John.

 19 I give unto you these sayings that you may understand and know how to worship, and know what you worship, that you may come unto the Father in my name, and in due time receive of his fulness.

 20 For if you keep my commandments you shall receive of his fulness, and be glorified in me as I am in the Father; therefore, I say unto you, you shall receive grace for grace."

 

So, just like Christ did not have the fullness at first but received it grace for grace we too, if we are faithful, receive a fulness which is to receive "all power, both in heaven and on earth, and the glory of the Father" in us.  A fulness is to be exactly like God.

[jerome1232]

Grande'] (Man: His Origin and Destiny, p. 129.)” (Mormon Doctrine, 517)."

So, according to the current materials you guys study, you will have spirit children in heaven?

Yes.

[Dorian]

True worship is the desire to be like Him.

 

D&C 93; "11 And I, John, bear record that I beheld his glory, as the glory of the Only Begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth, even the Spirit of truth, which came and dwelt in the flesh, and dwelt among us.

 12 And I, John, saw that he received not of the fulness at the first, but received grace for grace;

 13 And he received not of the fulness at first, but continued from grace to grace, until he received a fulness;

 14 And thus he was called the Son of God, because he received not of the fulness at the first.

 15 And I, John, bear record, and lo, the heavens were opened, and the Holy Ghost descended upon him in the form of a dove, and sat upon him, and there came a voice out of heaven saying: This is my beloved Son.

 16 And I, John, bear record that he received a fulness of the glory of the Father;

 17 And he received all power, both in heaven and on earth, and the glory of the Father was with him, for he dwelt in him.

 18 And it shall come to pass, that if you are faithful you shall receive the fulness of the record of John.

 19 I give unto you these sayings that you may understand and know how to worship, and know what you worship, that you may come unto the Father in my name, and in due time receive of his fulness.

 20 For if you keep my commandments you shall receive of his fulness, and be glorified in me as I am in the Father; therefore, I say unto you, you shall receive grace for grace."

 

So, just like Christ did not have the fullness at first but received it grace for grace we too, if we are faithful, receive a fulness which is to receive "all power, both in heaven and on earth, and the glory of the Father" in us.  A fulness is to be exactly like God.

Great, thanks.

Another question. You said that Jesus didn't have the fulness but received it later (after his time on earth?) But Paul says that Christ was equal with God and then became human. He didn't receive His fulness, rather he already had it and chose to become man.

"5Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, 6who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,7but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men." 

In LDS theology it seems to be all about man going up, whereas in Christian theology it seems to be about God coming down. How does this quote from Phillipians square with the idea that Jesus attained His Godhood or is subordinate to the Father?

[Dorian]

Yes.

 

Will your spirit children worship you like we worship our Heavenly Father?

[jerome1232]

No idea.

[Jane_Doe]

Great, thanks.

Another question. You said that Jesus didn't have the fulness but received it later (after his time on earth?) But Paul says that Christ was equal with God and then became human. He didn't receive His fulness, rather he already had it and chose to become man.

"5Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, 6who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,7but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men." 

In LDS theology it seems to be all about man going up, whereas in Christian theology it seems to be about God coming down. How does this quote from Phillipians square with the idea that Jesus attained His Godhood or is subordinate to the Father?

 

Before being born, Christ did not have a body like ours.  He did not get sick, hurt, or hungry.  Taking on an earthly body for His ministry here was in ways a step down: suddenly He needs sleep, gets hungry, and bleeds.  He knelt down, to be batter and bruised and tortured for all the stuff we do.  Such humility and giving 500% of one's self awes me.  

 

But after His dead and resurrection, His pain from the atonement was finished and His body was perfected.  While He could eat, He doesn't have to.  Nor does He now grow old and grey, or any other human frailties.

[Anddenex]

In LDS theology it seems to be all about man going up, whereas in Christian theology it seems to be about God coming down. How does this quote from Phillipians square with the idea that Jesus attained His Godhood or is subordinate to the Father?

 

Phillipians squares just fine with Truth (Jesus).  Jesus condescended from his statehood, Godly/Holy/Perfect, to do his father's will; although man, he was still one (equal) with his Father.  

 

John 6: 38, "For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me."  One doesn't perform the will of another unless there is some form of obedience.  If Jesus did not do the will of Him who sent him, would He have been perfect?  No.

 

Let's review the KJV, a translation we accept as more correct (Philippians 2: 6-7), "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God; But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men."

 

Sets perfectly well within Truth.

 

Let's review another passage similar to this spoken by John (John 5:18), "Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God."

 

Again, nothing unsettling to Truth given by the Lord's prophets in this the last dispensation.  

Edited October 1, 2014 by Anddenex

[annewandering]

I expect to have spirit children if I can get/keep this life on track. I dont know if my kids will worship me. They dont here very well. :) Maybe I will do a better job with the spirit ones!! At least there is lots of time to practice! I am a mom so my spirit kids will have a Mother in Heaven. and a Father in Heaven. 
 

I also expect to create worlds. Some back away from that doctrine but it puzzles me why. In this mortal life we move into our own house and raise our own family. I see no reason for that to change.  All in all it is going to be wonderful! Looking forward to getting there, after lots more learning than my poor mortal mind is capable of, and being with my husband and in a wonderful complete family unit again. 
What a blessing we have to know this is something that God has planned for us!!!  

[The Folk Prophet]

Why is this thread giving me major deja vu?

[Dorian]

Why is this thread giving me major deja vu?

Ha, I don't know, but it can sometimes be frustrating talking to Mormons about this stuff because they always say "it's just speculation" (like the first response here) but then the doctrine of having spirit children is right there in your official manuals! So it's not so speculative after all....

I just wish Mormons would be more upfront about their unique beliefs. I get the whole "milk before meat" idea but maybe the whole reason a lot of people are interested in Mormonism is because it's different from regular Christianity. Besides now that people have access to the internet down playing the unique bits doesn't work so well.

Thanks for your honesty, Annwandering :)

Edited October 8, 2014 by Dorian

[The Folk Prophet]

Ha, I don't know, but it can sometimes be frustrating talking to Mormons about this stuff because they always say "it's just speculation" (like the first response here) but then the doctrine of having spirit children is right there in your official manuals! So it's not so speculative after all....

I just wish Mormons would be more upfront about their unique beliefs. I get the whole "milk before meat" idea but maybe the whole reason a lot of people are interested in Mormonism is because it's different from regular Christianity. Besides now that people have access to the internet down playing the unique bits doesn't work so well.

Thanks for your honesty, Annwandering :)

 

Last time this question was asked I was quite upfront in my response. And then I got lambasted for it (by fellow Mormons nonetheless).

 

The liberal, p.c., how-dare-you, don't-offend-anyone, tolerance-is-the-most-important-virtue world we live in has curtailed a lot of ability to communicate openly and clearly concerning these things.

 

But the plain and upfront answers are:

 

Yes.

Yes.

We have no idea.

Yes.

[estradling75]

Ha, I don't know, but it can sometimes be frustrating talking to Mormons about this stuff because they always say "it's just speculation" (like the first response here) but then the doctrine of having spirit children is right there in your official manuals! So it's not so speculative after all....

I just wish Mormons would be more upfront about their unique beliefs. I get the whole "milk before meat" idea but maybe the whole reason a lot of people are interested in Mormonism is because it's different from regular Christianity. Besides now that people have access to the internet down playing the unique bits doesn't work so well.

Thanks for your honesty, Annwandering :)

 

There are simple reasons for this...  Your line of questions is a common attack vector.  So when a stranger whom we know nothing about and with minimal posting history comes along and ask your question, it is understandable that some of us will go defensive immediately, because they have been trained that the worst is yet to come.

 

The questions you are asking can't be answered with a reference to the our Standard Works.  Which means trying to prove that we are "Scriptural" in our beliefs (which is usually the next line of the attack) can't really be done.  It requires the words of Modern Prophets that while taught are not currently canonized.

[Jane_Doe]

Ha, I don't know, but it can sometimes be frustrating talking to Mormons about this stuff because they always say "it's just speculation" (like the first response here) but then the doctrine of having spirit children is right there in your official manuals! So it's not so speculative after all....

I just wish Mormons would be more upfront about their unique beliefs. I get the whole "milk before meat" idea but maybe the whole reason a lot of people are interested in Mormonism is because it's different from regular Christianity. Besides now that people have access to the internet down playing the unique bits doesn't work so well.

Thanks for your honesty, Annwandering :)

 

I understand your frustration here Dorian.

 

A lot of Mormons online (myself included) are quick to wave the "speculation" flag because I run across so many people who go "Wow, I just read this on the website '10 weird things about Mormons'-- do you really believe this bonkers?"  And I ask "Well, are you familiar with Mormon beliefs at all?"  "Nope and don't care, but do you really believe this [...]". ..... It becomes a quite tiresome conversation about the 200th time.