Opinion on the party gridlock?

[HomogenousHomo]

something that makes me quite angry these days, is the constant gridlock of the GOP, and the Democratic party. As a History major who minors in Political Thought, this is nothing new since the days of our fathers' fathers. 

 

What angers me the most in this day and age, is the taking advantage of certain causes, and straying from classic morals to new trends that the parties are taking. I feel they are almost taking advantage of the American people by making them believe for ages that we can only go both ways, and watch them arguing like buffoons in Parliament. 

 

Here is how my frustration has broken down:

 

-the core values of the Republican party are small government, personal liberty, and various libertarian views upon that it was based upon. Ironically enough, the Republican party has hosted sects of members that WANT to have a say on personal liberties, even though both parties should stay out of it. As a Libertarian, I believe the government should not even have a say, period, on marriage, and should be dictated by the people. Yes, I am gay, but I don't think its right that many of these states didn't vote on the topic of gay marriage. I am totally happy with getting married in Massachusetts. Why make those boring states down in the south conform? No fried-chicken honeymoon for me

 

Joking aside, I find the Democratic party to blame as well. While the Republicans have been straying farther from their morals, Democrats stand strong on national government control, and are enforcing it now than ever. With the Democratic party of the past stressing socialist ideals, they now put on the face of "equality." Equality, privilege, and health are the brand they endorse, but are simply a mask hidden by lobbyists to gain the minority vote. The Democrats are constantly praised on how progressive they are, but it took them 100 years to even get to the point of where the Republicans and Libertarians stressed the original importance of personal liberty and freedom. The Democratic party is using this equality front to gain the votes of the blacks, gays, latinos, and repressed minorities to give them hope for a better future, but are continuing our gridlock by taking away the rights of other individuals. These minorities on the extremist side constantly preach that the minority cannot turn into the oppressor, but you can just look at the Bolshevik's influence on Russia's working class to know that is indeed very wrong. 

 

These two transgressions have created the gridlock that has spanned hundreds of years since the birth of the terms "Anti-Federalist," and "Federalist." 

 

Regardless of your political views, how do you feel about the American party system, and its current situation?

[Windseeker]

Personally I'm not happy with either. If you really think about it, other then the politicians and big business, what group of Amercian people are well represented now days in goverment? I think not only are conservative/libertarian's not represented by the Republicans, but the liberal/progressives have horrible representatives as well. I remember when the cry of the left was "no corporate welfare!". You don't hear that anymore, probably because they don't want to lose power.

 

The historical problem with Republicans when they are right, is getting their message out. They are easily misrepresented and often because they historically stand on principle over politics. This is how the party that freed the slaves, enacted civil rights, gave birth to the NAACP (3 white Republicans and 32 black Republicans) stood on principle for States Rights (to not enact integration) and ended up losing the black vote. Republicans are often portrayed as racist (or uncle tom's if their black), selfish (even though W.omen I.nfant C.hildren was enacted by Republicans) and uncaring. Anyone that drives around my town last election could see the middle class homes had Romney signs and the big mansions along the intercoastal had Obama signs last election. So while Romney had the middle class vote, Obama had the vote of the Rich even though it was portrayed as the opposite.

 

Democrats were the party of slavery then and they are the party of slavery now. They can say whatever they want, it's politics over principle and it's "the ends justify the means". It's a party of racist and radicals. They are genius at manipulating people and name calling. They control the truly selfish that only care about their own circumstances so they pander to "self" interest groups that seek their own. They have Media, Hollywood, and Academia to ensure they have a constant influx of selfish useful idiots. Big Business is lining the pockets of Democrats and getting away with not paying taxes.

 

As far as gridlock is concerned I think the more the merrier at this point. The mask has come off Obama and he's more focused on his legacy, replacing Che Guevara's iconic image for the young, trendy and stupid with his own. So it's up to the "evil" Republicans to put a stop to this wanna-be folk hero who's praises will be sung by glassy eyed academics and our children in public schools for centuries despite the facts. 

 

I think we need term limits and flat tax, there is just too much influence by big business now days. I don't think it will happen without a revolution. 

Edited November 21, 2014 by Windseeker

[PolarVortex]

I am also a libertarian, and I agree that the government should have no role in marriage.  (It has a huge role, however, in protecting the rights and well-being of any children born to a man and a woman.  But if two or more people want to bind themselves into a next-of-kin relationship, and no children are harmed, that's their business.)

 

Political parties in the U.S. have evolved into religions.  People may be superficially loyal to the organizing principles of a political party, but they treat every political debate as a zero-sum Superbowl game where one side must win and the other side must lose.  Today's Democrats and Republicans remind me of the Catholics and Protestants in Northern Ireland during the worst years of that conflict.  I hope violence doesn't break out at some point, but I fear it will.  And, sadly, I think Obama is making things worse.

 

Why have the parties evolved into religions?  Because humans cannot help but be religious about something, even if they reject religion.  Dividing the world into "us" vs. "them" is deeply programmed into our DNA, as is our tendency to believe we are acting rationally when we are not.  Once you realize this, you understand why the message of Jesus is so revolutionary.

 

I tend to agree with Windseeker, but I think the revolution can be a peaceful one at the ballot box.  We really do need a new Constitution (or a long series of amendments) that can break up the politically petrified layers of this country and replace them with a more collaborative model in which good ideas and not political victories are prized.  Think of where this country would be if laws were created in the same way that new releases of Linux are prepared.  

[Guest]

I agree with what you say.  I'm not an American Citizen but I live in America, so I have the luxury of not having to take a specific politician's side.  These days, that usually means sacrificing certain principles to establish others.

 

But what really bothers me is with the Information Age, the voice of the people are better heard... and what you hear is crap.  The vast majority of voices are doing nothing more but cheering on their "football team" without any principles to stand on!  They categorize themselves with a label and then parrot what the politicians/lobbyists under that label say using it to bash the "other side".  They don't think beyond that!

 

THIS IS NOT FOOTBALL, PEOPLE!  You don't have to wear the jersey!

Edited November 21, 2014 by anatess

[Just_A_Guy]

I think it's important to note that we aren't really less civil than we've been throughout history, politically speaking (look at historical political cartoons sometime.  Some of them were positively vile--and they were ubiquitous). 

 

I'm a mixture of paleoconservatism and libertarianism; and as far as I'm concerned "gridlock" is a good thing more often than not.  It's there by design--the whole notion of checks and balances is rooted in the concept that governmental power is an inherent threat to a free people; and therefore it's supposed to be hard to get things done unless those things are clearly worth doing. 

 

As far as I'm concerned, any day that John Boehner, John Roberts, and Barack Obama are fighting each other is a day that they can't gang up on me.

Edited November 21, 2014 by Just_A_Guy

[Guest MormonGator]

I like gridlock. If nothing gets done, that means nothing bad gets done. I'm a libertarian as well. 

[Guest]

As far as I'm concerned, any day that John Boehner, John Roberts, and Barack Obama are fighting each other is a day that they can't gang up on me.

 

Unless they were such morons prior to pass some ridiculous law and now you want them to get off their butts to take it out.

[NeuroTypical]

I like gridlock also.  When groups of people get together to rule, there may be legitimate platforms and beliefs and agendas they seek to forward, but there is also a lot of nonsense that goes along with it.

 

I remember when the presidency and both houses were republican.  Yay - maybe we can finally make govt. smaller!  Yeah, that happened.  I remember when presidency and congress were both democrats.  Yay, my liberal friends said, maybe we can solve all these social maladies!  Yeah, that happened.

 

From where I'm standing, anything that makes people in the federal govt have a harder time passing new laws, the better.

Edited November 21, 2014 by NeuroTypical

[Vort]

The Republican party is corrupt and self-serving. It seeks primarily to perpetuate its own power. The very best thing that can be said about the Republican party is that it's not the Democratic party. Unfortunately, this is actually a big deal. Most Latter-day Saints find that the Republican party, with all its warts and stupidity, is an immensely better match for their values than the Democratic party. There is a reason the Democratic party's core values are watered down in Utah, and they still can't win an election outside of Salt Lake county.

 

Given the choice, I'll pick the Republicans ten times out of ten.

[Guest MormonGator]

The Republican party is corrupt and self-serving. It seeks primarily to perpetuate its own power. The very best thing that can be said about the Republican party is that it's not the Democratic party. Unfortunately, this is actually a big deal. Most Latter-day Saints find that the Republican party, with all its warts and stupidity, is an immensely better match for their values than the Democratic party. There is a reason the Democratic party's core values are watered down in Utah, and they still can't win an election outside of Salt Lake county.

 

Given the choice, I'll pick the Republicans ten times out of ten.

I go a bit further. There are two parties. The destructive (democrats) and the stupid (republicans). I'm one of those Ron Paulbots who is republican only because libertarians have no chance of winning. 

Edited November 21, 2014 by MormonGator

[Traveler]

At one time (in my youth many years ago) I was being groomed to run for office in the republican party because of my father that was very powerful inside the republican party.  It was the philosophy of my father that one become powerful within a party and then always vote exclusively for that party.  He would say there are no morals, values, views or agendas with politicians but what is dictated by their party.  So it was his notion that from a position of power within a party, if there is an issue of concern that you contact your representative and say "If you want any support or funding from republicans in XXX county you will vote for or against a specific bill."  He said that to call a representative and say, "As a citizen that you should represent; please support or do not support a specific bill" - you will be ignored.  And the more noise you make the more you will be believed to be a crack pot or extremists.

 

However, during the tenor of the Nixon era I had a falling out with the Republican party over issues that sent several of my fellow republicans to prison that I helped to uncover.  As a result, I was banned from inner circles of the national party elite and have not been politically active within a party since.  Those that say the political parties are corrupt - have no idea how deep and wide the corruption is.  I am convinced that if the public knew the truth of what is going on - with our elected officials, especially on the national level, that our elected officials would be dragged into the streets and lunched.  I do not say this symbolically - I believe that the treason and corruption is so bad that the public would be justified with bloodshed as much as any time in history that blood has been split for the sake of freedom and liberty.  I do not believe that there are any political accusations that are that far off the mark - but what sickens me is how one sided the accusations are from any source - seeing only the evils of their opponents and none of their own.  The contrast is an amazing exercise in extreme hypocrisy, political bigotry and prejudicial hatred.

 

Gridlock is not the problem - it is only a diversion to hide what new legislation has made the books.   The final things that amazes me is the silly dribble and complete nonsense being taught in the schools concerning political awareness - Well I guess that the ignorance and stupidity being taught in the schools is not what concerns me nearly as much as the student minions following blindly a failed education that will bankrupt the foolish and stupid students for most of their lives with student loans while they actually think they got something useful from their education that matters.  

Edited November 21, 2014 by Traveler

[yjacket]

Regardless of your political views, how do you feel about the American party system, and its current situation?

 

Hopeless, until Christ returns it will get worse and worse. There are times where the situation gets better for a bit only to be followed by another downslide.  In many ways, things aren't quite as bad as during FDR or Lincoln, but in many ways it's worse.

 

Politics is about power and money and until human individuals stop their desire to exert power and control over their fellow man it is a corrupt, immoral den of vipers and thieves.

 

A society always gets the government it deserves.  A moral, righteous society will never allow itself to be lead by a corrupt leader.

[FunkyTown]

I agree with what you say.  I'm not an American Citizen but I live in America, so I have the luxury of not having to take a specific politician's side.  These days, that usually means sacrificing certain principles to establish others.

 

But what really bothers me is with the Information Age, the voice of the people are better heard... and what you hear is crap.  The vast majority of voices are doing nothing more but cheering on their "football team" without any principles to stand on!  They categorize themselves with a label and then parrot what the politicians/lobbyists under that label say using it to bash the "other side".  They don't think beyond that!

 

THIS IS NOT FOOTBALL, PEOPLE!  You don't have to wear the jersey!

 

Yep. I've noticed that in American politics - It seems less about ideals and more about 'Support your local sports team' regardless of whether or not their views coincide with yours.

 

I have yet to hear an internet conversation that begins with "I like universal healthcare, but I'm not a fan of limitations on gun control. If I shoot myself, I'd love not to be bankrupt."

 

It seems pretty silly when you're external. Take Mitt Romney - There's a guy who as governor was a centrist technocrat, resolving issues with whatever tools he had to hand. Smart, respected the democratic process. The press demonized him and made him in to a Mr. Burns-esque caricature.

 

In order to even get a shot, I'm pretty sure he had to say the words 'Conservative' fifty-eight thousand times.

Edited November 24, 2014 by FunkyTown

[Traveler]

First I would like to make the point that if government really wanted to contribute to the solution of social problem - that it could.  If we consider poverty - the truth is that we could solve the problem of poverty in the USA.  We do have enough and plenty to spare.  But government by nature is not really about solving problems - it is by nature about governing.  In short it is about concentrating the power of a society among a few individuals.  And we have learned (by sad experience as well as admonishing in scripture) that when someone is given power that the most likely conclusions is that they will exercise unrighteous dominion.

 

But let is consider poverty.  In 1960 the most complete census of a society to ever take place - took place in the USA.  Some very smart economists looking at the data discovered that if we took just 2% of the gross national product and transferred that economic power directly into the condition of poverty that we could end poverty in the USA.  Under president Kennedy the Democratic party (but with bipartisan support) began laying the foundation of this noble endeavor.   However, it was not until President Johnston that legislation was finely passed.  But when the legislation was passed it had evolved.  It is my "humble" opinion that this evolution turned from a program to end poverty to a cleaver method to grab power (economic) and take extreme advantage of good will in US society as well as a political naive populous.  

 

At this point of my post - I would like to make clear that such an evil endeavor to grab power (economic) could not be accomplished by a few very smart power seeking individuals - this was far more sophisticated and required a full scale conspiracy operating through a large cross section of our society.  In other words an evil conspiracy on the scale of the Gadianton Robbers that brought down the Nephite society.  This conspiracy launched what has became known under President Johnston as "The Great Society". 

 

Since the inception of the great society this conspiracy has discovered a gold mine of opportunity and and sought more and more economic power.  Constantly touting a possible end to poverty and helping the down trodden and out of luck population that just needs a little more help.   The constant cry has been for just a little more money that the program will work so much better.  The result now is that we are transferring 12% of our gross national product - to who knows where - and poverty is as bad today as it was the day we decided to end poverty.    In essence we are transferring 6 time was is needed to end poverty and we have not ended anything - in fact many economists argue that poverty is worse today than it was before the effort was initiated. 

 

Could there be more evidence of total and complete failure?  But it is difficult to find even a single entity in our political system willing to admit that we need to dissolve our poverty programs and seriously start over from scratch.

 

Lets take another great program that no one wants to admit needs to be ended.  It is called Social Security.  Did you know that only 40% of the money distributed by the Social Security Department makes to to an individual on Social Security?  This is not 40% of the money paid to Social Security - but 40% of the money that the Social Security administration budgets.  Did you know that secret operations of the CIA are paid for by money collected by Social Security?  In other words the black ops that took of life of Bin Laden was not paid by tax payers but it was paid for by grandma and grandpa's diminished Social Security checks and if you live long enough to receive Social Security you will have helped pay for such things by happily receiving less Social Security Payments - or by paying more into Social Security - whatever or however you want to view what is happening.  

 

The point I would like to make is that none of this would be possible without the veiled cooperation of both parties as well as the vast majority of the media and the vast majority of the education system and a lot of other elements of our society cooperating to pull off such a thing on such a grand scale - and still have the majority of voters convinced that such programs are providing sufficient benefit for the cost.

 

There is no grid lock in passing what ever legislation is needed to increasingly feed the corruption and the vast conspiracy behind it.