father's blessing

[askandanswer]

A brother in our ward is asking questions about giving one of his children a father's blessing. It's something he wants to do today. This brother cannot use his Priesthood at this time. I haven't come across the concept before. Is it a "legitimate" thing to do and what might be said in such a blessing? I don't imaging that he could say, as is usually said in Priesthood blessings, I bless you that............Can someone please refer me to some teachings on this topic?

[The Folk Prophet]

You can't exactly use your priesthood if you're not authorized to do so, as priesthood usage is all about authority. His giving a blessing without being authorized to do so amounts to the same as someone not having the priesthood at all giving a blessing.

[Capitalist_Oinker]

TFP is correct.

 

A father's blessing is a priesthood ordinance, and as such it has to be invoked by the authority of the priesthood.

The principle is laid out in "Duties and Blessings of the Priesthood: Basic Manual for Priesthood Holders, Part B".

 

Speaking of the ordinance it reads:

"...giving father's blessings do not need to be authorized by the presiding authority. A man is authorized to perform [this] ordinance if he holds the Melchizedek Priesthood and is worthy.

 

In addition it reads:

"Fathers and others who hold the Melchizedek Priesthood may give blessings of comfort and counsel. Fathers may give their children blessings on special occasions such as when the children enter military service or leave home to go to school or on missions. A family may record a father’s blessing in family records, but it is not preserved in Church records.

To give a father's blessing or other blessings of comfort and counsel, one or more worthy Melchizedek Priesthood holders place their hands lightly on the person's head. Then the priesthood leader who gives the blessing:

1. Calls the person by his or her full name.

2. States that the blessing is performed by the authority of the Melchizedek Priesthood.

3. Blesses the person as the Spirit directs.

4. Closes in the name of Jesus Christ.

 

Obviously he can do what he chooses, but as far as the ordinance being recognized by God and ratified by the Holy Spirit, the blessing would have no validity.

Edited July 24, 2015 by Capitalist_Oinker

[askandanswer]

Thanks Oinker, this is exactly what I was looking for. It confirms what I thought was the case but now I know for sure and now I have a reference. I will make sure this reaches the brother who has the question.

[estradling75]

Now that you have the reference and what we are suppose to do..  I would like to point out something...

 

Fatherhood is a position of stewardship and authority...  And like any position of authority one should be worthy to perform the actions of such a position... In the cases where such a person performs unworthy they heap condemnation upon themselves but the ordinance itself is considered valid.  For example an unworthy priest blessing the sacrament does not invalidate the sacrament, an unworthy baptizer does not invalidate a baptism, and unworthy bishop does not invalidate all the callings, ordinances and other things he my take part in. 

 

So an unworthy father's blessing could still be recognized by the Lord as valid, to the condemnation of the father, and the blessing of the child. 

[Capitalist_Oinker]

Fatherhood is a position of stewardship and authority...  And like any position of authority one should be worthy to perform the actions of such a position... In the cases where such a person performs unworthy they heap condemnation upon themselves but the ordinance itself is considered valid.  For example an unworthy priest blessing the sacrament does not invalidate the sacrament, an unworthy baptizer does not invalidate a baptism, and unworthy bishop does not invalidate all the callings, ordinances and other things he my take part in. 

 

So an unworthy father's blessing could still be recognized by the Lord as valid, to the condemnation of the father, and the blessing of the child. 

 

I understand what you're saying, but I believe the issue here isn't one of unworthiness, but rather a lack of authority.

 

This is apparently the case based upon the statement: "This brother cannot use his Priesthood at this time."

 

I assume (and askandanswer can correct me if I'm wrong) that this brother is under some sort of disciplinary measure which deprives him of exercising his priesthood, hence he has no authority to do so.

 

Under conditions of unworthiness an ordinance may still be valid, but lack of authority makes ANY ordinance invalid.

 

This appears to be the case here.

[askandanswer]

 

 

I assume (and askandanswer can correct me if I'm wrong) that this brother is under some sort of disciplinary measure which deprives him of exercising his priesthood, hence he has no authority to do so.

 

 

 

He has been rebaptised but has not yet received his Priesthood. 

 

I should have known the answer to this question without asking. I was uncertain because I thought the two different names by which this ordinance is known - priesthood blessing and father's blessing - might have been referring to two different things.

[thoughts]

Women have never been ordained to the priesthood.  But they have been allowed to give blessings.   And woman have been known to give blessings to the sick, and their own children without any priesthood ordinations.

 

And there has been official counsel during the last ten years that fathers who are otherwise unworthy should be doing and/or participating in their children's ordinances.

 

I dont know what you mean about can't use the priesthood --- only the priesthood leader can order that, a person cannot decide that for himself.   But if I were this Dad, I would absolutely ask that priesthood leader for permission to bless a family member, whatever the restriction is.

 

And there is no reason he cannot pray for his child in every case.

[estradling75]

I understand what you're saying, but I believe the issue here isn't one of unworthiness, but rather a lack of authority.

 

This is apparently the case based upon the statement: "This brother cannot use his Priesthood at this time."

 

I assume (and askandanswer can correct me if I'm wrong) that this brother is under some sort of disciplinary measure which deprives him of exercising his priesthood, hence he has no authority to do so.

 

Under conditions of unworthiness an ordinance may still be valid, but lack of authority makes ANY ordinance invalid.

 

This appears to be the case here.

 

I understand what you are saying... but I am coming from the perspective of the child (or other person requesting a blessing)

 

The church does not generally announce discipline against a member.  The church does not want individual member making their own judgements about another person's worthiness (Nor does the Lord really), rather the church would hope an expect that to be left in the hands of the Bishop or other church leader. 

 

This is fine for all the ordinances which the Bishop oversees..  He can know about the authority (and hopefully worthiness) of the people involved.  But not all ordinances are done with a bishop's oversight.

 

Who vets the ordinances then?  The only real answer is the priesthood holder themselves.  This is fine when the priesthood holder is honest about his state. But what if they lie?  If the child (or other member) is acting in faith and doing everything they know and understand will the Lord have that return in vain or empty simply because of someone else's sin?

 

If you answer yes...  Then realize you set up a situation were the child (or other member) whom is desperately seeking the blessing of the Lord, must somehow judge the current worthiness/authority of the priesthood holder and has no real acceptable method to do so.  Do they conduct their own worthiness interview? Do they seek out the bishop for his "approval."  What can they do to make sure that someone else's problems don't stop them from the blessing they are seeking of the Lord?

[Jane_Doe]

- priesthood blessing and father's blessing - might have been referring to two different things.

 

A "father's blessing" is a priesthood blessing done by the father.

[Guest]

I understand what you are saying... but I am coming from the perspective of the child (or other person requesting a blessing)

 

The church does not generally announce discipline against a member.  The church does not want individual member making their own judgements about another person's worthiness (Nor does the Lord really), rather the church would hope an expect that to be left in the hands of the Bishop or other church leader. 

 

This is fine for all the ordinances which the Bishop oversees..  He can know about the authority (and hopefully worthiness) of the people involved.  But not all ordinances are done with a bishop's oversight.

 

Who vets the ordinances then?  The only real answer is the priesthood holder themselves.  This is fine when the priesthood holder is honest about his state. But what if they lie?  If the child (or other member) is acting in faith and doing everything they know and understand will the Lord have that return in vain or empty simply because of someone else's sin?

 

If you answer yes...  Then realize you set up a situation were the child (or other member) whom is desperately seeking the blessing of the Lord, must somehow judge the current worthiness/authority of the priesthood holder and has no real acceptable method to do so.  Do they conduct their own worthiness interview? Do they seek out the bishop for his "approval."  What can they do to make sure that someone else's problems don't stop them from the blessing they are seeking of the Lord?

 

I don't think this is the situation.  The question clearly says that the father does not have priesthood authority - he knows it, some members in his ward knows it, so the bishop must have discerned him unworthy to exercise such authority.

 

This is not a matter of somebody having Priesthood authority and is struggling personally with worthiness issues.  He may still have the authority to perform the ordinance but is just not sure... although, in this case, if the father thinks he is not worthy to exercise priesthood authority, he should abstain from performing the ordinance or seek counsel from the bishop.

 

I think there's a big difference between the two cases above.  So, for us giving advice to the father (or in this case, the ward member in the father's ward), the course of action is to abstain from performing the ordinance until his authority is restored.

 

What can a child do to receive blessings?  I thought that's what a Home Teacher is for... although, not a father's blessing, he can still provide blessings through his calling as Home Teacher.  Or there's the grandfather, uncles, bishop, or any other person close to him with the authority to perform the ordinance.

 

Edit:  I might be completely off-base in what your conversation is about.  I know you said from the perspective of the child... the child may not know that his father is not worthy to perform the blessing and he may ask the father... if the father performs the blessing, the child may still receive the blessing... but it would be kinda like the child asking to receive a blessing from the Catholic priest... the blessing may still be received but it is outside of the proper priesthood authority but under the umbrella of faith.

Edited July 27, 2015 by anatess

[estradling75]

I don't think this is the situation.  The question clearly says that the father does not have priesthood authority - he knows it, some members in his ward knows it, so the bishop must have discerned him unworthy to exercise such authority.

 

This is not a matter of somebody having Priesthood authority and is struggling personally with worthiness issues.  He may still have the authority to perform the ordinance but is just not sure... although, in this case, if the father thinks he is not worthy to exercise priesthood authority, he should abstain from performing the ordinance or seek counsel from the bishop.

 

I think there's a big difference between the two cases above.  So, for us giving advice to the father (or in this case, the ward member in the father's ward), the course of action is to abstain from performing the ordinance until his authority is restored.

 

What can a child do to receive blessings?  I thought that's what a Home Teacher is for... although, not a father's blessing, he can still provide blessings through his calling as Home Teacher.  Or there's the grandfather, uncles, bishop, or any other person close to him with the authority to perform the ordinance.

 

Edit:  I might be completely off-base in what your conversation is about.  I know you said from the perspective of the child... the child may not know that his father is not worthy to perform the blessing and he may ask the father... if the father performs the blessing, the child may still receive the blessing... but it would be kinda like the child asking to receive a blessing from the Catholic priest... the blessing may still be received but it is outside of the proper priesthood authority but under the umbrella of faith.

 

Your edit is closer to my intent.  The initial question was answered, and I am not challenging that answer but expanding on it.  Thus it is more of a tangent.  And that tangent is what requirement is placed on the child (or other member) in determining the current authority (or current worthiness) of the priesthood holder?

 

The answer seems to be very little.  If they know, then yes they should act on that knowledge, but if they don't know they don't have to 'vet' or otherwise dig in to find out.

 

Now you are probably correct in such cases any blessing that happen falls under the umbrella of faith versus priesthood authority, however the child is very unlikely to care or notice the difference because the two are so very tightly interlinked  

 

Thus a member whom is seeking a blessing should not be worried about the blessing being denied, because a priesthood holder was lying about his ability to perform such.  Instead they should be focused on their own faith and learning of God's will, so they can seek and gain a blessing from him.

[Capitalist_Oinker]

Women have never been ordained to the priesthood.  But they have been allowed to give blessings.   And woman have been known to give blessings to the sick, and their own children without any priesthood ordinations.

 

True, but perhaps it would be more accurate to refer to these "blessings" as prayers of faith, since no priesthood was invoked.

 

As to the many instances in history where women gave "blessings", it was almost always because there was no priesthood available at the time.

These "blessings" were fairly common at one time, but in 1946, Joseph Fielding Smith circulated a letter to Relief Societies which said:

"While the authorities of the Church have ruled that it is permissible, under certain conditions and with the approval of the priesthood, for sisters to wash and anoint other sisters, yet they feel that it is far better to follow the plan the Lord has given us [D&C 42:43] and send for the Elders of the Church to come and minister to the sick and afflicted."

 

"And there has been official counsel during the last ten years that fathers who are otherwise unworthy should be doing and/or participating in their children's ordinances."

 

That would depend on the definition of "unworthy", and whether or not he acts as voice. And regardless, the man MUST hold the necessary priesthood in order to participate. 

 

The current Handbook 2 spells it out clearly:

 

"As guided by the Spirit and the instructions in the next paragraph, bishops and stake presidents have discretion to allow priesthood holders who are not fully temple worthy to perform or participate in some ordinances and blessings. However, presiding officers should not allow such participation if a priesthood holder has unresolved serious sins.

 

A bishop may allow a father who holds the Melchizedek Priesthood to name and bless his children even if the father is not fully temple worthy. Likewise, a bishop may allow a father who is a priest or Melchizedek Priesthood holder to baptize his children or to ordain his sons to offices in the Aaronic Priesthood. A Melchizedek Priesthood holder in similar circumstances may be allowed to stand in the circle for the confirmation of his children, for the conferral of the Melchizedek Priesthood on his sons, or for the setting apart of his wife or children. However, he may not act as voice."

 

"I dont know what you mean about can't use the priesthood"

 

I gather from what askandanswer said, the man currently has NO priesthood to use. 

 

"And there is no reason he cannot pray for his child in every case."

 

Absolutely.

[Capitalist_Oinker]

If you answer yes...  Then realize you set up a situation were the child (or other member) whom is desperately seeking the blessing of the Lord, must somehow judge the current worthiness/authority of the priesthood holder and has no real acceptable method to do so.  Do they conduct their own worthiness interview? Do they seek out the bishop for his "approval."  What can they do to make sure that someone else's problems don't stop them from the blessing they are seeking of the Lord?

 

If we eliminate what we call "saving ordinances" (baptism, confirmation, Melchizedek Priesthood ordination (for men), the temple endowment, and temple sealing), along with a number of non-saving ordinances (naming and blessing a child, dedicating a grave, giving a patriarchal blessing, and preparing, blessing, and passing the sacrament, etc), which most assuredly do need authorization from a priesthood leader who holds the keys; then we are left with such ordinances as administering to the sick, giving father's blessings, and giving other blessings of comfort and counsel. 

As for these types of blessings your argument has merit. The woman (with the "issue of blood") who merely touched Jesus' cloak never received a priesthood blessing, and yet her own faith was sufficient to heal her. It's certainly plausible that a faithful child (or adult for that matter) could enjoy the same blessing despite a lack of worthiness on the part of one who performs the ordinance, and even apart from one who holds no legitimate authority to perform the ordinance in the first place.

[estradling75]

 

If we eliminate what we call "saving ordinances" (baptism, confirmation, Melchizedek Priesthood ordination (for men), the temple endowment, and temple sealing), along with a number of non-saving ordinances (naming and blessing a child, dedicating a grave, giving a patriarchal blessing, and preparing, blessing, and passing the sacrament, etc), which most assuredly do need authorization from a priesthood leader who holds the keys; then we are left with such ordinances as administering to the sick, giving father's blessings, and giving other blessings of comfort and counsel. 

As for these types of blessings your argument has merit. The woman (with the "issue of blood") who merely touched Jesus' cloak never received a priesthood blessing, and yet her own faith was sufficient to heal her. It's certainly plausible that a faithful child (or adult for that matter) could enjoy the same blessing despite a lack of worthiness on the part of one who performs the ordinance, and even apart from one who holds no legitimate authority to perform the ordinance in the first place.

 

 

 

Yes I am talking about non saving... non church approval required blessings.   

[Finrock]

 

If you answer yes...  Then realize you set up a situation were the child (or other member) whom is desperately seeking the blessing of the Lord, must somehow judge the current worthiness/authority of the priesthood holder and has no real acceptable method to do so.  Do they conduct their own worthiness interview? Do they seek out the bishop for his "approval."  What can they do to make sure that someone else's problems don't stop them from the blessing they are seeking of the Lord?

 

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ^aask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not ^btrue; and if ye shall ask with a ^csincere heart, with ^dreal intent, having ^efaith in Christ, he will ^fmanifest the ^gtruth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

5 And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may ^aknow the ^btruth of all things.

 

Not to say that this is where I'm at, but the scriptures invite and command us to use the Spirit to know the truth of all things. This is the way, the reliable way, for any man or any woman, to know and to discern what is going on around them and in life.

 

-Finrock