Are the "basics" enough?

[JojoBag]

During Elder's Quorum this past Sunday, one of the brothers said something that didn't set with me.  He said that all we had to do were the "basics" of the Gospel and we would make the Celestial Kingdom.  He said we didn't have to worry about the mysteries, we only had to do the basics that the leaders keep stressing.  This doesn't make any sense to me.  The basics are what you learn in elementary school.  It isn't enough for  you to graduate from high school let alone college.  Joseph Smith said that we must gain knowledge because we gain our salvation through knowledge. 

 

My understanding of why the leaders are stressing the basics is because the LDS aren't even doing the basics, let alone gaining a knowledge of the mysteries. I am reminded of the scripture that says:

 

 

For behold, it is not meet that I should command in all things; for he that is compelled in all things, the same is a slothful and not a wise servant; wherefore he receiveth no reward.

(Doctrine and Covenants 58:26)

 

Alma also talked about this:

 

 

9. And now Alma began to expound these things unto him, saying: It is given unto many to know the mysteries of God; nevertheless they are laid under a strict command that they shall not impart only according to the portion of his word which he doth grant unto the children of men, according to the heed and diligence which they give unto him.

10. And therefore, he that will harden his heart, the same receiveth the lesser portion of the word; and he that will not harden his heart, to him is given the greater portion of the word, until it is given unto him to know the mysteries of God until he know them in full. 

11 And they that will harden their hearts, to them is given the lesser portion of the word until they know nothing concerning his mysteries; and then they are taken captive by the devil, and led by his will down to destruction. Now this is what is meant by the chains of hell.

(Alma 12:19-1)

 

 

 

[Jane_Doe]

Yes and no.

 

If someone truly masters the basics (prayer, scripture reading, service, the Atonement, etc), then the complex stuff comes naturally.  

[Vort]

During Elder's Quorum this past Sunday, one of the brothers said something that didn't set with me.  He said that all we had to do were the "basics" of the Gospel and we would make the Celestial Kingdom.  He said we didn't have to worry about the mysteries, we only had to do the basics that the leaders keep stressing.  This doesn't make any sense to me.  The basics are what you learn in elementary school.  It isn't enough for  you to graduate from high school let alone college.  Joseph Smith said that we must gain knowledge because we gain our salvation through knowledge.

 

Your quorum brother is correct. The "basics" of the gospel are sufficient for our exaltation. But I would go even further: Those who concentrate on anything other than the "basics" of the gospel are looking beyond the mark and are in danger of losing their exaltation by concentrating on esoteric things of no worth.

 

The only quibble I would have with your quorum brother's statement is about the "mysteries". We are not Catholics. We do not believe in "unknowable mysteries". All things -- ALL things -- may be made known unto us by the Spirit. In LDS usage, a "mystery" is something unknowable by the carnal mind, but perfectly knowable by the spiritual. Faith is a great mystery. Repentance is a great mystery. Baptism and the gift of the Holy Ghost are nearly unfathomable mysteries. Yet these are the very foundation and bedrock of the gospel.

 

As for the things that many Latter-day Saints call "mysteries", they are not worth the breath it takes to name them. Ignore such things and follow your quorum brother's advice.

[Guest]

This is the first time I've heard an LDS use the word mysteries for gospel principles....

And yes, Vort hit the nail on the head with this one. So make sure you know what the Basics are.

[askandanswer]

I can't imagine the prophets and apostles ever telling us anything less than what we need to know and do to be saved. Since they are telling us the basics, then that is what we need to know to be saved. Since they are not telling us "the mysteries" then probably we don't need to know them to be saved. Nevertheless, I believe there can be great value in pursuing additional knowledge beyond the basics. I believe that as we come to better know and understand God's plans, and how He works, and why He does what he does, the knowledge we gain should help to increase our faith in, and reverence for, God and His works. And as our faith increases, so does our capacity to gain further knowledge. And yes, in many instances, it is highly probable that this increased faith and knowledge can aid in our quest for salvation, although it is probably not actually necessary for our salvation. 

Edited September 29, 2015 by askandanswer

[estradling75]

Lets see what are the "basics"  

 

Faith... the foundation of everything and something we want to grow stronger and strong.

Prayer... Communication with God... we want this to also grow, into deeper and more meaningful communications with God.

Scripture Study.. We are instructed to feast upon the words...

 

These three allow us to open up the heavens and have the "mysteries" of God revealed to us. (I consider repentance a natural part (change) as our faith and understanding develop because of the first three, but that is just me)

 

These are the keys Joseph Smith used to start the restoration of the gospel and to keep it going.

 

So yes the basics...  But the basics are all encompassing and will lead us forward to the ordinances and other things which our increasing faith will put into action.

 

Or in other words the basics are enough, but to be truly following the "basics" we can not be stagnate on them.  Stagnation means we are failing the basics at some level

Edited September 29, 2015 by estradling75

[Sunday21]

I think pursuing additional knowledge outside the scriptures is fine ...if you are doing the basics eg homet/visiting teaching, reading scriptures, family home evening, calling, temple, genealogy etc but if you are not then pursuing mysteries is a distraction.

[james12]

During Elder's Quorum this past Sunday, one of the brothers said something that didn't set with me.  He said that all we had to do were the "basics" of the Gospel and we would make the Celestial Kingdom.  He said we didn't have to worry about the mysteries, we only had to do the basics that the leaders keep stressing.  This doesn't make any sense to me.  The basics are what you learn in elementary school.  It isn't enough for  you to graduate from high school let alone college.  Joseph Smith said that we must gain knowledge because we gain our salvation through knowledge.

I think a misunderstanding has crept into the hearts of some members of this church regarding this issue of mysteries. Some hear the word mystery and fear others will "seek beyond the mark" or lose themselves in some gospel hobby. But others hear the basics over and over again and begin to feel limited in spirit. How do we navigate between these extremes? 

 

Let's take the first principles and ordinances of the gospel as an example, these are faith, repentance, baptism, and gift of the Holy Ghost. We talk about them over and over again. These principles and ordinance are not first because they are simple, but rather, because they are foundational. In other words they form the base of further spiritual growth in the church. Without a firm foundation we will falter. So it is vital that we never leave these principles (see Heb 6:1 JST). However, it is also vital that we build upon them. We cannot be content with just a foundation but must finish the structure to the pinnacle.

 

So, if you are grounded in the basics of the gospel do not fear to uncover truth. But use these foundational principles to uncover the mysteries. For instance, learn by faith (not simply secular study). Seek through prayer. Listen to the spirit of the Lord which will whisper to your heart.

 

To those who reject this process everything becomes a mystery. They do not understand the spirit of the Lord at all, they question promptings, they even question that there is a God. They have cut themselves off. 

 

 

 

 

 

[The Folk Prophet]

The basics are the means to the mysteries.

[Palerider]

I think something that Elder Ballard stated in a recent talk he gave can be tossed in the mix, ... We also need to study and read the Book of Mormon or we won't make it in the last days when things get tougher than they are now.

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

I have two thoughts about this.  First, I think that we have a tendency to think we know "all about the basics".  I know I have made that mistake.  I think there is much more we can all learn about "the basics"....possibly though they are things that we won't learn simply from attending classes on Sunday, but that we need to seriously ponder and ask the Lord.

 

My second thought is that the real challenge appears to be enduring to the end.  The older I get, the more friends and family I see falling away from the church.  People I never would have dreamed would leave are leaving.  Once I came very close to leaving myself, fortunately I survived by crisis of faith.  We are all, and will all be tried and tested in ways we cannot now imagine because that is the purpose of this life...to be tried and tested, and to learn and grow.  Hopefully throughout this process, we will endure to the end.

[The Folk Prophet]

Hopefully throughout this process, we will endure to the end.

 

I expect you didn't mean this, but stating it this way makes it sound like it's a matter of luck.

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

I expect you didn't mean this, but stating it this way makes it sound like it's a matter of luck.

 

How do you get that out of what I said?  Reading my whole post in context I think it should be clear that that isn't what I meant. 

[The Folk Prophet]

I think it should be clear that that isn't what I meant. 

 

Not so clear that I felt like I shouldn't raise the point.

[Guest]

... My second thought is that the real challenge appears to be enduring to the end.  The older I get, the more friends and family I see falling away from the church.  People I never would have dreamed would leave are leaving.  Once I came very close to leaving myself, fortunately I survived by crisis of faith.  We are all, and will all be tried and tested in ways we cannot now imagine because that is the purpose of this life...to be tried and tested, and to learn and grow.  Hopefully throughout this process, we will endure to the end.

This makes good sense and strikes me as a productive way of putting it. The way you utilize the word "hopefully" is positive and wholesome to this reader and connotes not a reliance upon luck nor chance but an expectation of things to come. It reminds me of 1 Corinthians 13:13.

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

This makes good sense and strikes me as a productive way of putting it. The way you utilize the word "hopefully" is positive and wholesome to this reader and connotes not a reliance upon luck nor chance but an expectation of things to come. It reminds me of 1 Corinthians 13:13.

Yes, that scripture is perfect, thanks!

[Blackmarch]

I think the article that's on the main page of this site is a good example of how important basics are.

Article Link

Edited October 2, 2015 by Blackmarch

[Traveler]

The basics are all that is needed!???? The question quickly becomes - what are the basics?  In computers the basics are sometimes considered 0 or 1 and fundamental ways of manipulating the 1's and 0's such as and, or and exclusive or.  And from such basics we have created artificial intelligence.  In truth the basics covers everything - sort of what the Folk Prophet said as a construct of basic elements.

[Vort]

I think the article that's on the main page of this site is a good example of how important basics are.

Article Link

 

I agree with you. But what a sad and messed-up article. Judging from Megan's other blog postings, she has a plethora of other issues to work through, and is still struggling with one foot in Zion and the other in Babylon. (Perhaps we all are. But I'm not sure I will ever understand those who seek to make their private struggles public, with no sense of shame or embarrassment. It seems a version of the "my-poop-don't-stink" mindset.)

[Darren]

We learn from the story of Moses and the children of Israel about the one basic principle of the gospel, to focus your mental energy upon Jesus Christ, to "always remember him." All of the rest of the doctrines and commandments are to help you in your journey to do that one thing. Find the path to that one destination is the one basic principle of the gospel. What happens along the way as you work to travel that path and find the helps you need to get there are where we find the commandments and doctrines that are beyond that one basic principle of the gospel.

 

1 Nephi 17:41. … He sent fiery flying serpents among them; and after they were bitten he prepared a way that they might be healed; and the labor which they had to perform was to look;  and because of the simpleness of the way, or the easiness of it, there were many who perished.

 

Alma 33:18.  But behold, this is not all; these are not the only ones who have spoken concerning the Son of God.

19.  Behold, he was spoken of by Moses; yea and behold a type was raised up in the wilderness, that whosoever would look upon it might live.  And many did look and live.

20.  But few understood the meaning of those things, and this because of the hardness of their hearts.  But there were many who were so hardened that they would not look, therefore they perished.  Now the reason they would not look is because they did not believe that it would heal them.

21.  O my brethren, if ye could be healed by mearly casting about your eyes that ye might be healed, would ye not behold quickly, or would ye rather harden your hearts in unbelief, and be slothful, that ye would not cast about your eyes, that ye might perish?

 

 

Helaman 8:13 ... and also the words that were spoken by this man, Moses, who had such great power given unto him, yea, the words which he hath spoken concerning the coming of the Messiah.

14.  Yea, did he not bear record that the Son of God should come?  And as he lifted up the brazen serpent in the wilderness, even so shall he be lifted up who should come.

15.  And as many as should look upon that serpent should live, even so as many as should look upon the Son of God with faith, having a contrite spirit, might live, even unto that life which is eternal.

 

2 Nephi 25:29.  ... the right way is to believe in Christ, and deny him not ... ye must bow down before him and worship him with all of your might, mind and strength, and your whole soul; and if ye do this ye shall in nowise be cast out.

 

In this passage Jacob cites the error of the Jews his family had left behind in Jerusalem.

 

Jacob 4:14.  But behold, the Jews were a stiffnecked people; and they despised the words of plainness, and killed the prophets, and sought for things that they could not understand.  Wherefore, because of their blindness, which blindness came from looking beyond the mark, they must needs fall …

 

In the Book of Jarom, written some 200 years after Nephi’s time, Jarom chronicles the effort of the Church in his day.

Jarom 11.  Wherefore, the prophets and the priests, and the teachers did labor diligently, exhorting with all long-suffering the people to diligence; teaching the law of Moses, and the intent for which it was given; persuading them to look forward unto the Messiah, and believe in him to come as though he already was.  And after this manner did they teach them.

 

God Bless,

Darren
 

[f1lbr]

Your quorum brother is correct. The "basics" of the gospel are sufficient for our exaltation. But I would go even further: Those who concentrate on anything other than the "basics" of the gospel are looking beyond the mark and are in danger of losing their exaltation by concentrating on esoteric things of no worth.

While I agree with your first statement, I believe the portion highlighted is erroneous.  I believe it would be more correct to state, 'Those who concentrate on any gospel principle to the exclusion of the "basics" of the gospel are looking beyond the mark and are in danger of losing their exaltation.'

 

Consider, for example, this quote by Joseph Smith:

 

 

 

“… A man is saved no faster than he gets knowledge, for if he does not get knowledge, he will be brought into captivity by some evil power in the other world, as evil spirits will have more knowledge, and consequently more power than many men who are on the earth. Hence it needs revelation to assist us, and give us knowledge of the things of God.”

 

There are numerous others that are also of relevance to which we are encouraged to gain knowledge.  However, in none of these are we command to only gain knowledge of the "basics" of the gospel.

 

Spoken of in another way, if there are "basics" of the gospel then there are "non-basics" of the gospel and if they are true principles of the gospel then are they not worthy of study and understanding?

 

The area where many people have gotten into trouble in "advanced" topics comes from two places:

 

1) Advanced topics are generally taught through personal revelation and not through a person's own personal reasoning.  Reasoning may be involved in the process, but ultimately revelation is the governing principle.  Advanced topics are not taught in Sunday School or through General Conference.  They are to be received through personal revelation.  As personal revelation, these things are not to be shared.  They're personal.  And once shared the spirit is grieved and withdraws and opens the person up to false revelation.  When you hear someone "sharing" so-called "mysteries" you know that invariably they are on the wrong course: either they have not received revelation on the subject or they have and are in error for sharing personal revelation.

 

2) Leaving behind the basics of the gospel.  This invariably causes troubles for those who are seeking, shall I say "too hard", after mysteries.  The basics of the gospel are the fundamentals and the foundation and when one leaves those safe foundations for the sandy ones, they invariably open themselves up to false doctrines.  For the "advanced" doctrines will never conflict with the "basic" doctrines.

 

Now that being said, I will give a word of advice: the "mysteries" or the "advanced" gospel topics are readily available.  But don't force the process.  The easiest way to be taught those things is to study the basics, frequent the temple, be open to revelation and you will be taught the advanced things line upon line.  Always guard those things sacredly in your heart.  When the Lord can trust you with his secrets, He will give you more.

 

The true "mysteries" are not "esoteric things of no worth", but are truths which will deepen your understanding, strengthen your relationship with the Savior and bless you in your confidence before the Lord.

[Vort]

Spoken of in another way, if there are "basics" of the gospel then there are "non-basics" of the gospel and if they are true principles of the gospel then are they not worthy of study and understanding?

 

No, they are not. God stands nine feet seven inches tall (or some other specific height; the point is, God has actual physical characteristics, including height). God's physical height is a truth, yet it is of absolutely no saving consequence.

[The Folk Prophet]

No, they are not. God stands nine feet seven inches tall (or some other specific height; the point is, God has actual physical characteristics, including height). God's physical height is a truth, yet it is of absolutely no saving consequence.

 

Actually, I believe 6'1.5" is the "perfect" height.

[bytebear]

The basics to me are understanding the covenants of the gospel, entering into those covenants and living them. That seems sufficient to me.

[f1lbr]

No, they are not. God stands nine feet seven inches tall (or some other specific height; the point is, God has actual physical characteristics, including height). God's physical height is a truth, yet it is of absolutely no saving consequence.

 

Nice strawman.  Of course, God's physical height is not an example of what I was talking about and isn't a gospel principle.

 

Look, let me give it to you another way.  When we tell children that they'll live with mommy and daddy forever, you and I both know that what they understand that to mean is not what it really means.  But we teach it to them and let them understand it in a simplified manner because that's what they're capable of understanding.  The broader truth of that principle is something they will figure out as they mature.

 

The gospel is similar.  We understand things with a limited capacity.  The spirit teaches us as our capacity grows.  The "mysteries" is nothing more than the deeper and more profound knowledge of the "basics".  That's part of the reason for the danger is seeking out the "mysteries" while ignoring the "basics"; you're likely to find something that is not founded on the "basics".

 

Now let me give you a clear example of this. D&C 19 reveals a "mystery" (and even calls it that). Namely that there is no eternal torment or eternal damnation.  This isn't "faith, repentance, baptism, gothg".  It's a bit deeper than the "basics".  One can argue that that little tidbit of knowledge isn't relevant to our eternal salvation.  Yet apparently the Lord felt it was worth revealing.