LDSCubsFan

I have not noticed that in my ward. What I have noticed, though, is that Church members try to keep money within the Church. For example, when the bishop thinks a couple needs marital counseling, he will refer them to professional marital and family therapists, who are conveniently members of the Church. In my previous ward one of the members was a real estate agent. Naturally, she was given all the referrals to new families who moved into the ward and needed to buy a home.

NFL football coach Andy Reid, currently with the Chiefs, formerly with the Eagles.

I have been a member of the Church for over 10 years. However, I sometimes have some things about my belief which nags me. These things that nag at me wax and wane. First, I regularly read the Bible, Book of Mormon, D & C, and Pearl of Great Price. It strikes me that some of the passages in the latter three, especially the Book of Mormon, are nearly identical to passages from the Bible. For example, 3 Nephi 14:18 says, "A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit." I know I've read a very similar passage in the Bible; I just don't recall what book. The Mormon in me says that this is not unusual, since all of these works were inspired by God. The skeptic in me, however, wonders if this indicates that Joseph Smith plagiarized the Bible in his creation of the Book of Mormon. Add to this some of the apparent anachronisms in the Book of Mormon, such as elephants, horses, pigs, and cattle, just to name a few....and my skepticism grow rampant. I would love to believe in this Church, because the people truly are wonderful and united. However, I get these doubts, which I usually end up casting off by thinking, "You got to believe something," and "Even the Bible has fantastic stories that are hard to believe, such as Jonah and the Big Fish, Noah and the flood, etc. I mean, you gotta admit Joseph Smith having been visited by John the Baptist is hard to believe....but, then again, no more hard than some of the stories from the Bible. Anyway, that is my struggle. I don't bother talking about this to the bishop or the missionaries, because I know their canned response would be for me to pray about it, feel the spirit, it's the devil making me have those doubts, etc. Still, I struggle with it, and have been on and off for the past 10 years plus.

I certainly think about it all the time. Seriously. I think about it much more often than I get it.

#7 can be interpreted so broadly. For example, what if you are a teacher in a school system that teaches students something the church opposes? What if you support a candidate who happens to support an issue that the church opposes? What if your non-LDS wife drinks coffee?

It is so comforting to be around people who are generally selfless, compared to the selfishness usually encountered in everyday life. I must say that this sense of selflessness I get from fellow congregation is much stronger in the mormon church than it was in the other churches (Methodist and non-demoninational Christian) I attended before becoming mormon. At the other churches I've been too, it seemed like there was a preacher or minister standing up on a platform talking to a bunch of peons below. With LDS, I feel like I am actually part of the lessons and part of the mission to spread the gospel. Sadly, I also feel that many of the other churches are formed for the purpose of making money or obtaining power, and that some of the clergy who run them are crooked. There are some that are run with good intentions too. With LDS, I know there are no paid clergy. I also know the same lesson that was taught today (in this case, it was testimony Sunday) was the same lesson taught today in every other branch or ward no matter how big or small. My faith and commitment to the church continues to grow.

Shawnspencer, it would not kill you, it just seems like that right now. Trust me, you'll get over it. We've all been there, missionaries or not.

Sorry, but I have heard many times from fellow LDS, including some raised in the church and including one that is now a bishop, that the reason blacks used to not be allowed to obtain priesthood had to do with the Nephite/Laminite thing. Now that the issue has generated much publicity lately, the LDS church is suddenly saying it doesn't know what the reason is for this? One can't help but to wonder what "revelation" the living prophet will get next.

It bothers me too. But, I just have to keep reminding myself that no matter what church I belonged to or what religion I believed in, there would be things about it that bother me. You gotta believe in something.

I read the history of Joseph Smith last night, as told in the triplex BOM/D&C/POGP book. It was the first time I had read the story since around the time of my baptism 12 years ago. Upon reading the part where JS says Moroni appeared to him three times during one night, and quoted verses of the Bible that were just a little different than as they appear in the Bible, something dawned on me. What would you say to a skeptic who claims that JS wrote the BOM, and the reason he made a point to say Moroni quoted the Bible a little different than how it is printed is to support JS's untruth that the BOM was necessary in part because messages in the Bible were lost in translation and/or to justify that the BOM portrays the gospel slightly different than the Bible? Myself, I would answer the skeptic by saying that to believe JS had a vision is no more far-fetched than believing Moses or any of the other dozens of biblical characters had visions of angels. In fact, it even takes faith to believe in Christ. I suspect many of my fellow Mormons will have reasons to refute skeptics based on personal testimony, such as personal feelings they received when praying about whether it was true. I personally have never had the burning in the bosom while reading any part of the BOM (or the Bible) or while praying whether or not it was true, although I experienced a burning in the bosom (or whatever it's called) while I was in the midst of investigating the LDS church with missionaries and this led me to get baptized.

Thank you, Bini. With coffee and iced tea, perhaps I should have referred to them as "tasty" rather than fun. Coffee has been an occassional drink for me during my pre-LDS and inactive LDS years, and I can't say that I still don't drink it from time to time. Iced tea with lemon is absolutely delicious, and no calories to speak of to boot. It used to be my drink of choice since I am diabetic and I can't stand the taste of diet sodas. I really don't even like to drink any alcohol anymore. I even decided this during my inactive LDS years. I think getting drunk or even getting under the influence of alcohol is just foolish, although I couldn't care less about who does it. When I talk about things that are "fun," I am talking about the more wicked things. Hey, I've done (and thought about) those things for more than half of my life. I guess if I stay active in my church I will find spiritual things to be fun, but it is challenging when LDS makes up such a small minority in my area (even my wife and step and other family is non LDS). I'll just have to keep reading the BOM and staying active in the church and staying in contact with LDS members as much as possible. I know that helps.

This is starting to sound like a test, especially in light of your statement on a previous thread. I like the way he dropped down out of the sky. I like the way people were in awe, and most people were righteous after his visit, until a few (many) years after he left some of them began to get wicked again. There are messages in that.

I like 3 Nephi, especially the part when Jesus Christ visits the Americas. Question, though: The church only holds that he visited the Americas, correct? It is unknown whether it was North, central, or South?

Do my fellow mormons ever think that they are not allowed to have fun? Seriously. I joined the church about 12 years ago, and there have been many times since then that I feel that I am depriving myself of fun things. I can do without hard liquor, but iced tea and coffee sure is good once in a while, and even a beer or two during the Superbowl. And, gosh...some of the more wicked things...wow. But, I am not going to be one that does these things and pretends like I am a member in good standing. (I have a feeling there are those that exist.) I am either going to do them and drop out of the church altogether, or do them and just not go to the temple and not be very involved in the church while attending services regularly and paying tithing. I believe the church has some good messages, and I love the way it makes members feel like family, but the dogma is sometimes overwhelming. I am not saying I am going to stray. I will keep reading the Book of Mormon and other scriptures and going to church and being active with fellow members and praying with the hopes that my "dirty thoughts" will go away or at least become manageable. I'm in my 40s, by the way.

I do not deny Satan exists. Nor do I deny that Satan tempts us to get off the righteous path. What I was referring to in my OP is that it seems like some church members attribute little things to Satan's work. For example, I recall when my Stake President a few years back asked me to seek a certain position or responsibility in the church. When I said I wasn't ready for that (I was a new member), he said it was the devil giving me doubt. I recall when I told my home teacher a few years ago that I thought I was not good at a certain skill, he said that was nonsense and that it was the devil giving me such a thought. I recall at my baptism, one of the missionaries said the baptism almost didn't take place because of an issue with the baptismal font (or something like that...it was a technical issue), and she attributed this to the work of the devil in an effort to prevent the baptism from taking place.