Trumpetguy

Would Jesus say this?

The pharisee and scribes did well along external show along compliance.... Jesus made it clear not to be like them, and my Catholic friend simply being real and relaxed, you attack? For what purpose, and I have to ask, how in shape you are? Me? Jesus drank the forbidden "wine" on the last supper, he would be super due for a cig or cigar from heaven for all that's to come about his path on the next..... something none of us would volunteer for, but He Did! Post your heart here my friend, all of you Catholic or LDS or what ever! I have a sick feeling along LDS so far, it's getting deeper the longer I put up with them.... I know, not PC but I'm also being real!

Two things jump out at me along this discussion, more but won't make a novel out of a post here. What's being described here seems like it's stemmed from the Catholic belief in Purgatory, a place between heaven and earth where the souls are purged from this world and made worthy to enter the kingdom of heaven for eternity. There is also mentioned, the whole struggle with the trinity, how two seperate entities can be seen, side by side, God the Father and God the son. Isn't is stated where Jesus is, Mark 16:19 After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God. He goes on to explain that even though he's leaving, he's returning in another form, that of the Holy Spirit, for he's not orphaning them as he stated. Now, opposing side of this, Genesis, Let "us" make man in our own image. This connotates there is more then one if taken literally. Do we then assume there is no trinity, but only three entities working together? Nope, for what is the first commandment: You shall have no other gods before me. doesn't imply there are three but one, and you are forced to decide along how He established the trinity prior to creation, thus Father, Son, Holy Spirit were the same one God, but established in different manners, such as when someone puts on a tool belt, drives an auto and talks on the phone, same person performing three rolls and tasks. With the other reference along Paul talking along how we all need Christs grace, some people skim over the whole "equally" part. The fact of the matter is, it's not about simply conforming to a set of rules or system at all, else the old testiment would still be in place. The reality is, our fallen state, our human existance as created beings is in a flawed state by default, something we inherited from Adam. Even on simple terms, what does God have any use for along the function and use of eyes, ears, mouth, nose, as is formed within the physical make up of a human being? This must mean something else when it's stated "created in HIs image", and it's a spiritual creation, a soul, a spark of his own essence when it comes down to it. Can God add or take away from Himself? Ask yourself another question, can God make a rock too heavy for Him to lift? It's the same thinking we have to understand, and to be honest, I see far, far too much focus on external elements rather then internal. Some of the most "clean living", perfectly squeaky clean looking and acting can be some of the absolute worse sinners of all, worse then murderers, because their hearts and minds are not right... It is written a whole slew of type of sinners will not enter the kingdom of heaven, but it specifically goes on to strongly condemn, to the point of saying the individual is cursed for leading "these little ones astray", and even after the list, it goes on to state that all sin is forgivable except for blasphemy against the Holy Spirit..... I don't need to get too much into the latter here, but just saying what it is, plainly along this topic, the original one.

is it not written that any failure of the law is the same as murder?

What does Paul have to say on this???

First off, mere attendance of the mass every Sunday "or the Saturday vigil", along with attending during the holy day's of obligation is only the absolute bare minimum requirement to be in good standing with the Catholic church, assuming you are also taking part in the sacraments and remaining compliant within there as well. It's more then just showing up, doing your thing and leaving, be it this happens far too often these days, and I call those types cafeteria Catholics. Being Catholic is a way of life, it's a belief system that transcends this world and it's a daily practice. I strongly recommend talking to your local RCIA instructor, they should enlighten you as to what you are really leaving, and most that leave the church don't really know what they are tossing away for they have not remotely explored what it truly means to be Catholic at all. Don't worry about having a Catholic funeral, your non attendance will disallow this to come about even if your family insists upon it, the churches policies are pretty firm in this department, and as I heard a priest mention one time, "They don't participate or practice the Catholic faith while living, why would they desire this after they die?". My grandmother passed on a few years ago, she claimed the Catholic faith but refused any attendance or involvement even though I earnestly tried to get her to come to mass, she made up one excuse after another not to attend, but at least she received her last rites from a priest before she passed on. There are many that choose to stop attending, stop being involved, stop living the way of life a proper Catholic does, only to come back to the church years later. It's rarely at the prompting from someone in it, but prompted by the Holy Spirit, and nothing unusual with playing prodigal son in that aspect, it's almost a right of passage these days. When you were baptized, it was for the purpose of removing original sin, it was also baptism into the Catholic church, and it's only a one time thing. We accept many protestant baptism's for those that convert to the Catholic church as being equally valid, so no need to re-baptize as well. There is a fullness in the church I never realized until several years ago, something I found in no other church even remotely, and this is something yet to be discovered by you and by many Catholics. Sure, I was raised in the church, but that was a former life I like to think, it took the second time around to truly know what it means to be Catholic, and this was through extensive study, scrutiny and testing. I take nothing on the surface, I have to know it, inside and out, and I ask questions, lots of them, the answers I receive have to have some form of scriptural roots, and this is what I find in all things, be it the dogma to the belief structure, to the traditions, to even the format of the mass to be. But, it's something you have to desire to do on your own and nothing I can share is going to win you over on this one. Take note, "this" Catholic is reaching out to you, so you can no longer say nobody in the church is doing this, yet I do admire the LDS towards their outreach, something I wish we had more of here.

To the OP, that attitude is pretty common these days, yet there are lot's of common beliefs as well that aren't necessarily true. You are in a church that strongly emphasis's traditional values in marriage, something most out side of any church does not, so by all means, don't marry outside of the church, else you are not having your faith to keep you bound together and help guide you both towards a happy marriage. Still, regardless of where you meet, take the time out to court them properly. Get to know each other yet really get to know all of their friends and family, see the full picture, you aren't marrying just one person per say, you are marrying into the family, and trust me, you'll pick up on red flags during the process soon enough since it's a bit difficult to hide your true nature, good or bad, when you are around your own friends and family. Moving forward here, it was stated before, love leaves yourself vulnerable, and it's the whole trust issue that has to be first established, else it can't go anywhere. We also have to have faith that God will guide our steps, just as long as you are being honest with yourself and realistic. Don't wait too long though, the older you get the fewer truly single, available women you will encounter. I'm still single and I'm older then you, it really, really bites, but I'm giving you fair warning, life is too short to go at it alone, it really is.

It's an onion skin, layer type of thing, where just before you move onto the next level, or next layer is revealed, you go through what is called the dark night of the soul. I'm in it right now and it's been a struggle. I have my up's and downs, and I have to admit, the work I do for the faith out in the world does take it's toll to boot. I read people, their energy, their intentions, and it's a good thing when I get to take a break from having to deal with negativity, or just worldly mindsets for a change. It's almost like I was born too late in this culture, my values are so old school and traditional, but then again, I suppose we are born into this world to show through example what these increasingly declining values are about. Thank you all for your warm replies, it's good to feel welcomed.

I have been alone most of my life in so very many ways, but God has been with me all the while. I have searched out so very many churches, am a very devout Catholic, but have never been welcomed anywhere for any meaningful way, manner or aspect outside of the superficial. I go to mass, I go to protestant services, I go anywhere in the world, alone, always alone, just me myself and I, and it's just a given that the pew I will be at will be empty next to me and remain so. I see families sitting together, couples with their arms around each other and think, what would it be like to actually have that for myself, and here I stand, at the age of 47, still alone, pretty much friendless, no relatives that speak to me on any regular level, and barely even had a girlfriend in the past, much less a wife and kids... I have been involved doing chairity work, helping the less fortunate, I read the bible every day, I pray to our Lord, and I sacrifice on so many levels to help others, to put them before me as our Lord has for us. I have been shunned, told and treated as an outcast, badly, and yet I endure. My heart has been bruised, beaten down, downtrodden, to the point I wonder in spite of all I have endured if I will ever make it into God's kingdom, since I have had to pull my heart back into myself, to no longer smile and no longer love for it's not given to me and this world has been absolutely crewel to me so far. I have been to so very many different churches, often in the past with such meager transportation, if any at all, and have been shunned, scooted away, made to feel like I was less then a human being. I'm pretty beaten down at this stage in my life, even though on the exterior I seem to be taking care of business, inside, I'm a broken man. I have such a great big heart to love, and it's still extended, but it's also something that just get's trashed by all around me, and I can attest, I'm kind of hurting at the moment I'm writing this as well, so please don't think this is all I'm about, I very much do have times where the Lord uplifts my heart, mind, body and soul to very high levels, but for now, just being off the cuff and sharing my who I am at the moment. I attended my first Mormon church last Sunday, and it was good to finally connect with some God, faith, bible believing people, people with correct traditional values, people that didn't have selfish personal agenda's, people that accepted me, this wanderer in this world into their world, even if it's just for show, even if it's just for the day, at least I didn't feel alone, I didn't feel like some ghost among the ranks. I did notice the rest, with their spouses and families, and took heartfelt note, I was there alone, but not alone, one of the missionaries talked to me, and actually sat beside me during the services. I was for a moment, even if it wasn't real, at least for that time, I was with some people and fit in, in worship and praise for our Lord. I have been alone since the age of 7, that was 40 years ago, I am going back there next Sunday, yes, I am a very devout Catholic, this won't change, but I have so many questions along your book, and it doesn't seem like a deal breaker with me. Please excuse the many questions I"m going to pose on this place, I so want to know you all more and this group, one that made me finally feel welcomed, and no I am not some odd looking/acting/etc. individual, nor are there any issues going on, but when you are devout, intelligent, this world doesn't want you around neither does it's people, this I have found out the hard way. All I know is that our faith, the Christian faith is supposed to be about love, God's love, our love, and this is what I try to emulate, and I so love seeing this in what I experienced, to be loved and it being genuine. Thank you for getting through the read on this, it's been a trying past period of time for me, but am humbly moving forward and seeing a people like you, God fearing, Bible believing, Loving, a complete breath of fresh air for me!